St Patrick's day

No negativity implied here personally boab1916! As I conclude from your writings that none of your points are anti Irish intent.

but just a few wee thoughts as you did suggest to others to go read history!

How certain can anyone be about anything? how certain can we be of events reported just yesterday that we were not present at?
but about someone supposedly from the 5th century? someone of a totally different world regardless of even if native stock who spoke a language in a dialect none of us could have credibly understood many if any word of!

You are repeating origin claims one of the many different versions of the origin about Patrick as if 'fact', but what are actually nothing more credible than stories and myths.

Some of which were specifically recreated re-written by the imposed Norman French clergy , tales written hundreds of years after events the best part of a millennia after!, stories retold on behalf of and for the benefit of Norman French land and asset grabbers, especially their 'king grabber'.

If you asked the Irish of the last century, many if not most would have to mind a possible 'French origin for Patrick, the british :giggle: tale is a much more recent story.

Anyway unless you speak old Latin please don't reply with Patricks supposed Confessio, as the claims for that! are that - just claims!

there is no credible evidence let alone proof! that he as a individual existed! let alone that he was actually some supposed self identified brit, which is a pitiful and laughable idea, as a reality check: - no one until well over a thousand years after the supposed time of 'Patrick' would even use the word british in print, let alone an identity for mass of very different tribes (many of who were Irish origin tribes) who spoke many different tongues on a island would self identify commonly as at the time of patrick!

All that british stuff is about as old as the steam train, invented for colonial wars.

Even the extremist whack jobs who sailed in the mayflower, who were not the first or even second European immigrant North American town makers (british BS history teachers selectively ignorant of St. Augustine for example)
even those whack jobs did not use the word or claimed themselves as English let alone british.

History is ever so slightly more complex than repeatable soundbytes and especially very modern british colonial contrived bs soundbytes, stories of supposed history, many based on agenda for purpose of resources theft.

If there is no proof that any individual such as Patrick existed ever?
Then what about those Norseman French and their story tellers! The story of Patrick whether French or Welsh or Scot (not that either nation existed as we know it at that time)

Ever considered how convenient tales they are - whether the older tale that he was from France or more recently that he was kidnapped from Britain.
The story that someone to look up to, to pay allegiance to was a foreigner, more Irish than the Irish!

They like all asset grabbers, prefer to have a 'storyline' that promotes the idea that they are not mere thugs and criminals, but benefactors as they murder and plunder.

Go read history and study as some have done for decades, search for the actual evidence that Patrick was real let alone an immigrant! you will not be able to find what can be considered historical evidence beyond even the most basic questions.

So your own ideas are nothing but stories! british bias centric stories, simple to learn by purpose and design, so they catch on and are repeated like a simple virus.

Versions of the Patrick story' can be found in the old colonization of any land, a central foreign figure to be listened to, more respected than their own native kin.
Thankfully for the story tellers, human beings are essentially a pack type of species the world over.

But the Irish contrary to what some imagine here and there! are no more likely to betray or begrudge their own, it could be credibly argued from historical account, that with their long list of martyrs and those who defied the odds at all costs, that there is something in the land that evolves the DNA to not be so keen to join in with the pack mentality!

Anyway back to St Paddy, No one knows for certain who Patrick was or if he was even a single individual person.
For certain no credible history can claim that Patrick was the first Christian in Ireland, there were very likely native Christians prior to him if he ever existed as a person.
maybe they were not evangelicals, more isolated in prayer or Christians more by deed,
Be good to think so as they are always the more credible 'Christ like' people for want of a better word than those with a megaphone in the high street telling you what Jesus meant.

Some professional historians imagine or conclude from presumably long study that - the persona was created from a number of different Christian monks, or not even Christian events, their deeds combined and incorporated to invent someone to look up to, a central iconic figure to convert and conform the masses. more incorporate and conquer than divide and conquer, but same end goal.
No credible scholar for example believes there was an abundance of snakes to banish, yet people like yourself quote the rest of the story as if fact!

These tales combined the story of Patrick!
were just as likely all Irish natives in origin, deeds recalled but names forgotten, easy to rewrite and incorporate!

Consider that the peoples, the tribes of the island of Ireland themselves, who for centuries around and after the time of Patrick were exporting monks to other islands, including your own land of Scotland, let alone needing to kidnap some supposed native brit to come over and teach them what 'Jesus actually meant'.

Norman theft of land. the Time of the political Popes!
It could be argued that 'Patrick' needed inventing, not just for Norman colonial theft but for the Irish incorporation into the Rome based Christian ideas of what Jesus meant!
There are as credible claims that early Irish Christianity was more like eastern orthodox.

No matter what any claim here! logically if not for certain those ancient Irish Christian would not recognize any mass anywhere in the world of today!

the only absolute fact of the icon is that today and for many a decade now, most Irish people at home and more so those Irish and of Irish ancestry and connections around the world, know and recognize the day as theirs.

And that is the real significance of worth of the created evolving image of Saint Patrick.

The Irish themselves alone, along with their ancient story telling abilities have created and evolved a global brand long before coca cola evolved.

Leaving aside the Chinese new year, which is not quite the same, but never the less the only comparable national global iconic image.

No other nation has a day that is so iconic, apart from China none anywhere has a national day that even approaches the global iconic status of IRISH DAY.

Regardless of the silliness the drink the reason behind the need for a day, a people held back denied rights, ridiculed mocked, just like none of you would have a Celtic FC if it were not for the Irish of the past, a day the world knows! that is a remarkable achievement of the Irish of the past.

one many other nations, most especially the britlanders are extremely jealous of!
For what it's worth Jim I read your entire post, a lot of what i would have said but couldn't be arsed going to all the trouble you did.
I've stated already that this was supposedly a light hearted thread, and the comment that soured sour arse about two types of people in the world those who are Irish and those who wish they were Irish. This is so obviously a joke, but obviously the aforementioned individual doesn't have a sense of humour. I make no apology as i have nothing to apologise for. It was a fucking joke! If someone changed the Irish to Scottish, I would laugh at it rather than take offence. And then to copy and paste half a story off Wikipedia to offer as an argument is pathetic. Then to go on and attack Irish people for no reason other than me cracking a joke is fuckin pitiful. Now, I know reaction this will get, just because I'm not part of the clique,but I don't give two fucks.
Again great post Jim. And incidentally I had a fuckin great day yesterday and so proud to be Irish and if you don't like that you can fuck off!
 
Maria said:


Just getting ready for my meeting. Hair is soaking n get a call from my sister saying my aunt died. Mums in bits shit.

A hate this pish.

Still got a meeting i need to go to so off to dry the hair.

New it was imminent anyway.

Maria sorry to hear the news, thoughts with you and family.

candle.gif
 
For what it's worth Jim I read your entire post, a lot of what i would have said but couldn't be arsed going to all the trouble you did.
I've stated already that this was supposedly a light hearted thread, and the comment that soured sour arse about two types of people in the world those who are Irish and those who wish they were Irish. This is so obviously a joke, but obviously the aforementioned individual doesn't have a sense of humour. I make no apology as i have nothing to apologise for. It was a fucking joke! If someone changed the Irish to Scottish, I would laugh at it rather than take offence. And then to copy and paste half a story off Wikipedia to offer as an argument is pathetic. Then to go on and attack Irish people for no reason other than me cracking a joke is fuckin pitiful. Now, I know reaction this will get, just because I'm not part of the clique,but I don't give two fucks.
Again great post Jim. And incidentally I had a fuckin great day yesterday and so proud to be Irish and if you don't like that you can fuck off!
It takes two to tango, TD!

You gave as good as you got in that wee exchange and that was fair and right enough.

The Scots among us get our fair share of jibes and piss taken, especially those of us with a foot in both camps. It's the nature of the beast in Scotland and it means that we have to respond in kind and somewhat aggressively to counteract it.

Having got to know many folk on this site over the last year, it is impossible for me to conceive that the folk you are referring too are nothing but supportive and immersed in the Irish cause and community.

The same persons that will stand shoulder-to-shoulder with you in the face of adversity and hostility, TD. Right there by your side and providing warmth and shelter when required.

I understand that being Irish is a different experience for every one of us who can lay claim, exactly the same that being Scottish does not guarantee accordance in all views.

I'm glad St Pat found you well, I hope this message also finds you well as you are a valued contributor with many outstanding opinions.

The day is past now, it's time for us all to move on HH
 
It takes two to tango, TD!

You gave as good as you got in that wee exchange and that was fair and right enough.

The Scots among us get our fair share of jibes and piss taken, especially those of us with a foot in both camps. It's the nature of the beast in Scotland and it means that we have to respond in kind and somewhat aggressively to counteract it.

Having got to know many folk on this site over the last year, it is impossible for me to conceive that the folk you are referring too are nothing but supportive and immersed in the Irish cause and community.

The same persons that will stand shoulder-to-shoulder with you in the face of adversity and hostility, TD. Right there by your side and providing warmth and shelter when required.

I understand that being Irish is a different experience for every one of us who can lay claim, exactly the same that being Scottish does not guarantee accordance in all views.

I'm glad St Pat found you well, I hope this message also finds you well as you are a valued contributor with many outstanding opinions.

The day is past now, it's time for us all to move on HH
Yes sp I know it takes two to tango and I know I gave as good as I got. I was merely defending myself to what I seen as a totally unnecessary response to a light hearted comment a joke infact. How come no one else responded that way?
If I had made the same comments about Scottish people as he did about Irish people I would have been attacked on here and rightly so.
I am also aware the day has passed, I also had moved on yesterday until the subject was dragged up again today. Do you expect me to ignore comments made about me?
And as I've said before, this was supposed to be a light hearted thread, until it was twisted around!!
 
Falling in love with that wee fella more and more each pic, D.

What a handsome wee man that is!


Thanks SP, hope your wee feline friend is doing well
Yeah, Beau's a beauty alright
And his nature, matches his looks
He's a ten year old Labradoodle, we rescued him and he fits right in with our family
ANyway, ST. Patricks Day is over for another year
Mate of mine spent it in Maui, after the groundng of Boeing 737 Max 8's
He was the only one quaified to work in the States
His Dad was Irish, his Mother, Scottish and he was born in the US, although hm and his wife and kids, live in Western Canada
Couldn't think of a more fittng person to go...
Works 2 hours a day, then the rest of the time is his...so the pub it is...;-)
A week in the sun, and getting paid for it
HH
 
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It's pretty hypocritical to provide a lecture to someone about the lack of empirical factual content in an earlier post, by then going on to provide unfactcheckable content of your own, Jim.

Not sure how your "credible claims" rooted in history can be anymore credible than any other person's claim?

The matter was effectively put to rest
!
First off I will decide for myself when I can post, I am not going to seek approval before any post!
for you it may have been settled, not for me it wasn't.

I posted because I considered the original topic was exactly as the poster claimed and agree that the use of language is common use in Ireland and I have heard Irish people in England and Scotland use effectively the same, because - its a saying not a fecking literal claim!

I also know that some (not boab19160 ) in britland like to demean the day and nit pick at details of a saint, yet call out the Irish when ever they want to be literal!!!!!
some laughably even claim patrick as a brit!
because the feckers are as jealous as feck, and it really fecking irritates them that the world for a day is Irish and see Irish as something to be proud of and dont see being Irish as anything like a brit comedy sketch from the last century.

Same reason the huns call you plastic paddys and some of you lot are sadly ignorant and naive enough to accept the term as credible!

To your specific point, that would be a fair point if! I actually made any point of fact to be referenced.
credible claim is still a claim not a fact and I made that clear!
So apart from the conclusion if read, the one fact that it - the event - has evolved and that the Irish own it, not some once again not literal saint! is a reality, a fact!

1,286 words. Copied it, put it in a text document and had a program (LibreOffice Writer) count the words. To be honest, I couldn't get through it. I would wager that I wasn't the only one. I'd even give odds at 6-to-5-and-pick-'em that boab1916 fell asleep trying to read it.
I get that the post wasn't written for me, a non-Irish person. I even get that St. Patrick possibly (probably?) didn't really exist and that it could be an amalgam of people in a mix. I even know the historical inconsistencies of his story, let alone the commandeering of the "myth" by the ruling class to keep others down.

Regardless, I understand that March 17 will remain a special day for the Irish. But I also agree with boab1916's point that the day should be observed without arrogance, and clearly seeking clarification can be sought if the original poster's intent was misunderstood.

Curious you post in ridicule and in claim to not get through it! but yet quote points made and claim to have known them all prior, yet you still get the central point incorrect to make mention.

As I clearly and specifically in post and response stated that it was aimed at all who identify with being Irish, not some specific idea on what IRISH is!

The only plastic paddies to me are the descendants and hangers on of parasitic colonial terrorists who come out of buckingham palace to hand out shamrock to parody Irish regiments.

plastic paddies.JPG
I take mild offence at your smartness, but disappointed at your misquoting me!

Anyway to be fair your main derision was correct as any real effort in posting is wasted here.
so removed the guts of the post and left the summary as that was the point and its a point that winds up brit feckers! as there is nothing left for them to try and rewrite.
so is all the point needed.

I'll stick to smiley face and wows from now on here, and not too many words, thanks for the tip mr bookie!
Every day is Paddys day
 
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First off I will decide for myself when I can post, I am not going to seek approval before any post!
for you it may have been settled, not for me it wasn't.

I posted because I considered the original topic was exactly as the poster claimed and agree that the use of language is common use in Ireland and I have heard Irish connected people in England and Scotland use effectively the same, because - its a saying not a fecking literal claim!

I also know well that some (not boab19160 ) in britland like to demean the day and nit pick at details of a saint, yet call out the Irish when ever they want to be literal!!!!!
some laughably even claim patrick as a brit!
because the feckers are as jealous as feck, that the world for a day is Irish and see Irish as something to be proud of and not have as a brit comedy sketch from the last century.

to your specific claim, that would be a fair point if I actually made any point of fact to be referenced.
credible claim is still a claim not a fact and I made that clear!
So apart from the conclusion if read, the one fact that it - the event - has evolved and that the Irish own it, not some once again not literal saint! is a reality, a fact!



Curious you post in ridicule and in claim to not get through it! but yet quote points made and claim to have known them all prior, yet you still get the central point incorrect to make mention.

As I clearly and specifically in post and response stated that it was aimed at all who identify with being Irish, not some specific idea on what IRISH is!

The only plastic paddies to me are the descendants and hangers on of parasitic colonial terrorists who come out of buckingham palace to hand out shamrock to parody Irish regiments.

View attachment 1952
I take mild offence at your smartness, but disappointed at your misquoting me!

Anyway to be fair your main derision was correct as any real effort in posting is wasted here.
so removed the guts of the post and left the summary as that was the point and its a point that winds up brit feckers! as there is nothing left for them to try and rewrite.
so is all the point needed.

I'll stick to smiley face and wows from now on here, and not too many words, thanks for the tip mr bookie!
Every day is Paddys day
So by your own hand, Jim - your analysis of what it means to be Irish is the last word and those of us in britland have no decisive voice on the matter.

An opinion is an opinion. It's fine that you have one, but you're then denying anyone the right to be critical of Ireland and its own indiscretions.

The point of being a true patriot is not about nationalism, but about carving a future that benefits everyone. Like Scotland, Ireland has been its own worst enemy throughout history. It took a common enemy to unite the counties, but the same former hostilities reared their ugly head within a decade of the Republic.

Should we all just embrace the lucky charms and clover? Should we not be questioning the hazy shades of history in North America and Australasia?

We've been quick to point the finger at british tyranny and bloodlust. Sometimes we have to be a little introspective too.

I'm proud of what Ireland has become and becoming, but that doesn't compensate for some of the shite we inflicted upon each other. Not only North and South, but also East and West and across the globe.

As I mentioned previously, I am Scottish by birth and nature and I am a fierce critic of what Scotland is and what it represents. I am an Irish citizen also and I'll be damned if I don't call out injustices on all sides. I love my countries dearly, but I refuse to be an apologist for either.
 
First off I will decide for myself when I can post, I am not going to seek approval before any post!
for you it may have been settled, not for me it wasn't.

I posted because I considered the original topic was exactly as the poster claimed and agree that the use of language is common use in Ireland and I have heard Irish people in England and Scotland use effectively the same, because - its a saying not a fecking literal claim!

I also know that some (not boab19160 ) in britland like to demean the day and nit pick at details of a saint, yet call out the Irish when ever they want to be literal!!!!!
some laughably even claim patrick as a brit!
because the feckers are as jealous as feck, and it really fecking irritates them that the world for a day is Irish and see Irish as something to be proud of and dont see being Irish as anything like a brit comedy sketch from the last century.

Same reason the huns call you plastic paddys and some of you lot are sadly ignorant and naive enough to accept the term as credible!

To your specific point, that would be a fair point if! I actually made any point of fact to be referenced.
credible claim is still a claim not a fact and I made that clear!
So apart from the conclusion if read, the one fact that it - the event - has evolved and that the Irish own it, not some once again not literal saint! is a reality, a fact!



Curious you post in ridicule and in claim to not get through it! but yet quote points made and claim to have known them all prior, yet you still get the central point incorrect to make mention.

As I clearly and specifically in post and response stated that it was aimed at all who identify with being Irish, not some specific idea on what IRISH is!

The only plastic paddies to me are the descendants and hangers on of parasitic colonial terrorists who come out of buckingham palace to hand out shamrock to parody Irish regiments.

View attachment 1952
I take mild offence at your smartness, but disappointed at your misquoting me!

Anyway to be fair your main derision was correct as any real effort in posting is wasted here.
so removed the guts of the post and left the summary as that was the point and its a point that winds up brit feckers! as there is nothing left for them to try and rewrite.
so is all the point needed.

I'll stick to smiley face and wows from now on here, and not too many words, thanks for the tip mr bookie!
Every day is Paddys day
Good post Jim. Never seen that video before!
 

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