Every single player yesterday was on more money than his Hibs counterpart.

Theverdict1

Well-known member
As someone who likes value for money, it is impossible to see that when you look at too many in our squad. We all know that out of the 20 or so players Rogers has bought, we can say only possibly five fit that criteria.

Yesterday’s shameful capitulation and lack of anything in a football context, reinforces my belief that too many are picking up substantial wages, yet when called upon to come in and do a job are found lacking.

We play with the same players all the time. Our best team is still Lennon and Delias team in the main. Around a dozen additions since Rogers came in are nowhere near good enough. The result being, when any of our first choice players are injured, we stall against players on a fraction of what our over paid flops are on.

Hayes is not good enough and has done literally nothing to earn his wages. Sinclair is being continually played and if anybody thinks he would still be on the park if Rogers hadn’t spent good money on him, they need to get to the doctors.

As I said in another thread, getting beat by Hibs is always possible, but to play as we did yesterday was beyond belief. We really only have about 13 players who can do the business. The rest of the pool are expensive passengers we cannot afford.

Rogers talks about the gulf in resources when we play in Europe, and he is right. But when you look at our limited resources being wasted on players that are crap, that’s his fault. You can sympathise with Lawell when the wage bill passes his desk and he sees 50% of them he would have trouble recognising in the street.

It’s time to cut our loses and let them all go for whatever we can get. Even if that only means reducing the wage bill. Rather than twelve players doing nothing, it would be much better to have four who when called upon can be better than a Hibs player on £1,000 a week. If that.

For Rogers part, and not Congerton, Rogers, he needs to up his game in who he gives the green light to. We spend £60m a year in wages and with at least a third of that going out the door on no return, no wonder we cannot afford better quality.

What he was thinking with Hayes should be the subject of an Arthur C Clarke Mysteries programme. He said recently sentimentality played no part in how he sees things. I find that hard to believe. I have a simple rule of thumb, as a boy I had great hopes of playing for my team, if I can accept I wasn’t good enough to play for Celtic, I’m Fucking sure I can do the same with anybody. It should never be a sentimental journey. You are either good enough to wear the hoops, or you can do one.

Right now we have up to 15 players in that category and they need to go. Reinvesting the money we waste on players who when called upon can out perform any opponent in the SPFL on a fraction of the money, is the absolute least we should demand.

January is vital for us and not just in relation to who we bring in, just as important is getting rid of those players who will never cut it.

Thursday showed that even our best team needs help. Which we all knew, but beyond that out reinforcements as like Dad’s Army, well meaning, nice guys, but when the fighting starts, they are worse than fucking hopeless.

Monday morning dissapointment is not a good feeling, but much worse is the feeling that nothing has been learned about too many players underperforming when they need to step in.

Hopefully, this will be addressed, because we are bleeding cash on too players who are no better than average and who when given a chance bottle it.

Get your act together Brendan, accept you have made too many errors in judgement and ensure anydody to come is worthy of wearing the hoops. There is only a more competitive league because we have gone backwards, not that anybody else has improved. We should be out of sight. The reason we aren’t resides in the judgement of Rogers.

Lawell needs to back him, but, you can’t blame him if he questions his judgement, the wage list proves he is right to be less than convinced.

Let’s push on and get to that fabled higher level we keep being promised. It’s been a long time coming. Let’s start in January. HH
 
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As someone who likes value for money, it is impossible to see that when you look at too many in our squad. We all know that out of the 20 or so players Rogers has bought, we can say only possibly five fit that criteria.

Yesterday’s shameful capitulation and lack of anything in a football context, reinforces my belief that too many are picking up substantial wages, yet when called upon to come in and do a job are found lacking.

We play with the same players all the time. Our best team is still Lennon and Delias team in the main. Around a dozen additions since Rogers came in are nowhere near good enough. The result being, when any of our first choice players are injured, we stall against players on a fraction of what our over paid flops are on.

Hayes is not good enough and has done literally nothing to earn his wages. Sinclair is being continually played and if anybody thinks he would still be on the park if Rogers hadn’t spent good money on him, they need to get to the doctors.

As I said in another thread, getting beat by Hibs is always possible, but to play as we did yesterday was beyond belief. We really only have about 13 players who can do the business. The rest of the pool are expensive passengers we cannot afford.

Rogers talks about the gulf in resources when we play in Europe, and he is right. But when you look at our limited resources being wasted on players that are crap, that’s his fault. You can sympathise with Lawell when the wage bill passes his desk and he sees 50% of them he would have trouble recognising in the street.

It’s time to cut our loses and let them all go for whatever we can get. Even if that only means reducing the wage bill. Rather than twelve players doing nothing, it would be much better to have four who when called upon can be better than a Hibs player on £1,000 a week. If that.

For Rogers part, and not Congerton, Rogers, he needs to up his game in who he gives the green light to. We spend £60m a year in wages and with at least a third of that going out the door on no return, no wonder we cannot afford better quality.

What he was thinking with Hayes should be the subject of an Arthur C Clarke Mysteries programme. He said recently sentimentality played no part in how he sees things. I find that hard to believe. I have a simple rule of thumb, as a boy I had great hopes of playing for my team, if I can accept I wasn’t good enough to play for Celtic, I’m Fucking sure I can do the same with anybody. It should never be a sentimental journey. You are either good enough to wear the hoops, or you can do one.

Right now we have up to 15 players in that category and they need to go. Reinvesting the money we waste on players who when called upon can out perform any opponent in the SPFL on a fraction of the money, is the absolute least we should demand.

January is vital for us and not just in relation to who we bring in, just as important is getting rid of those players who will never cut it.

Thursday showed that even our best team needs help. Which we all knew, but beyond that out reinforcements as like Dad’s Army, well meaning, nice guys, but when the fighting starts, they are worse than fucking hopeless.

Monday morning dissapointment is not a good feeling, but much worse is the feeling that nothing has been learned about too many players underperforming when they need to step in.

Hopefully, this will be addressed, because we are bleeding cash on too players who are no better than average and who when given a chance bottle it.

Get your act together Brendan, accept you have made too many errors in judgement and ensure anydody to come is worthy of wearing the hoops. There is only a more competitive league because we have gone backwards, not that anybody else has improved. We should be out of sight. The reason we aren’t resides in the judgement of Rogers.

Lawell needs to back him, but, you can’t blame him if he questions his judgement, the wage list proves he is right to be less than convinced.

Let’s push on and get to that fabled higher level we keep being promised. It’s been a long time coming. Let’s start in January. HH
All true verdict,our wages/transfer policy is abysmal,huge wage bill with players never playing,several deep in positions and all picking up good money.A couple of examples defensive mid brown,kouassi,mulumbu,bitton,4 deep and only brown that manager trusts,right back lustig,Gambia,Ralston and don't forget we tried to sign Puccini in the summeron the left,Sinclair,Hayes,Morgan Johnston.All much of a muchness ,no idea what our strategy is these days
 
All true verdict,our wages/transfer policy is abysmal,huge wage bill with players never playing,several deep in positions and all picking up good money.A couple of examples defensive mid brown,kouassi,mulumbu,bitton,4 deep and only brown that manager trusts,right back lustig,Gambia,Ralston and don't forget we tried to sign Puccini in the summeron the left,Sinclair,Hayes,Morgan Johnston.All much of a muchness ,no idea what our strategy is these days

It seems to me to be one of hope over practicality in too many instances. Taking a punt at times I agree with. But we have double figures in that category. So far, we have to admit hope has been misdirected. I would be interested to know how much money goes out the door on players who have as much chance of holding down a place as you or I do.

Going cheap has always been the Celtic way. We could have had Benkovic for £7m. Now it would be double that even if his team entertained it. These players cost but we would recoup that money. How many of the duds we bought will recoup even the wages they have been paid? None is my estimation.

We need to realise that quality costs but it returns too. We need to reduce the numbers but substantially increase the quality of those bought. To continue with the hope model will see us stuck in a cycle of spending on nothing but failures.

A clearout is long overdue. Four quality players who we can sell at a profit later and who move ya forward is better than 15 lesser paid duds who do nothing. And nothing is an exaggeration. They bleed us of money that we cannot afford.

We always bemoan not having enough, then accept 40% of what we do have being squandered. That is not too strong a description, it is being totally squandered.

I don’t know any company who squanders that percentage if it’s cashflow as being described as sound. It’s ridiculous and unsustainable, especially when we make a roaring arse of CL qualification.

I hope this week in the boardroom and Rogers this strategy is seen for what it is. And what it is, is abject failure.

Less in this case would Indeed be more and we would be able to field replacements who don’t embarrass the hoops.

We tool up properly and win the league and qualify for the CL, there is circa £60m to ensure the new strategy can work. Fail to act and our chance to bury everyone at home will disappear.

January is the most important window for many years. Let’s hope the board and Rogers realise this and stop relying on hope. HH
 
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It seems to me to be one of hope over practicality in too many instances. Taking a punt at times I agree with. But we have double figures in that category. So far, we have to admit hope has been misdirected. I would be interested to know how much money goes out the door on players who have as much chance of holding down a place as you or I do.

Going cheap has always been the Celtic way. We could have had Benkovic for £7m. Now it would be double that even if his team entertained it. These players cost but we would recoup that money. How many of the duds we bought will recoup even the wages they have been paid? None is my estimation.

We need to realise that quality costs but it returns too. We need to reduce the numbers but substantially increase the quality of those bought. To continue with the hope model will see us stuck in a cycle of spending on nothing but failures.

A clearout is long overdue. Four quality players who we can sell at a profit later and who move ya forward is better than 15 lesser paid duds who do nothing. And nothing is an exaggeration. They bleed us of money that we cannot afford.

We always bemoan not having enough, then accept 40% of what we do have being squandered. That is not too strong a description, it is being totally squandered.

I don’t know any company who squanders that percentage if it’s cashflow as being described as sound. It’s ridiculous and unsustainable, especially when we make a roaring arse of CL qualification.

I hope this week in the boardroom and Rogers this strategy is seen for what it is. And what it is, is abject failure.

Less in this case would Indeed be more and we would be able to field replacements who don’t embarrass the hoops.

We took up properly and win the league and qualify for the CL, there is circa £60m to ensure the new strategy can work. Fail to act and our chance to bury everyone at home will disappear.

January is the most important window for many years. Let’s hope the board and Rogers realise this and stop relying on hope. HH
I agree and have always thought that to spend a bit more in key positions would not only help the team but would still yield profits should we sell on at some stage,we have already proved that a winning team with players performing will attract big bids.Not every player we sign can be a project,at certain times we need to bring in a certain quality and no i dont mean 10/15 million pound players,theres value to be had in certain markets,its up to the people being paid the big bucks to in recruitment to find these players.
 
Our squad at present:

Gordon - keep
Bain - keep
De Vries - move on
Hazard - keep

Izzy - keep
Hendry - move on
Jozo - keep
Lustig - replace asap
Gamboa - move on (BR doesn't fancy him)
Boyata - keep
Benkovic - keep ??
Compper - move on
Ajer - keep
Ralston - I'd keep but BR doesn't fancy him
Tierney - keep and beatify

Bitton - keep
Brown - keep
Benyu - move on
Mulumbu - move on
Sinclair - move on
Arzani - keep
McGregor - keep
Hayes - move on
Morgan - keep
Christie - keep!
Rogic - keep
Allan - move on
Ntcham - keep
Kouassi - probably move on
Forrest - keep!
Johnston - keep

Eddy - keep
The Griff - keep

I realise it's not as simple as just forcing these players out, but it's clear from that list that we have too many midfielders and not enough strikers or dependable right-backs.
 
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After a work night out on Saturday and a few beers for the match I came up with a daft theory...BR ment to lose the game. I couldn't think of any other reason why we played how we did on Sunday. He argued with Lawwell over tranfers again and wanted to prove a point. We have played poorly in several games this season but managed to scrape through due to BR makes a few changes but in this match he did nothing. 3 CB all playing within 5 yards of each other. Izzy running forward but not defending. Sinclair playing out of position on the right and Forrest, who has played RWB before, playing on the left. After 1 minute you could see that all hibs had to do was hit us on the wing. We could have played Ralston and Izzy and played 4 at the back. Brown sitting deep with Ntcham and McGregor further forward. Sincy and Forrest on the wings and eddy up top. BR didn't have to play the formation that he did...when he saw after 45 seconds that it wasn't working he could have changed it easily but chose not to. I just don't understand why....obviously I don't believe for 1 second that he threw the match in the sober light of day. I just don't understand the excuse of having players out injured. We could have played our same formation with the players we had.....still fucking annoying me!!
 
After a work night out on Saturday and a few beers for the match I came up with a daft theory...BR ment to lose the game. I couldn't think of any other reason why we played how we did on Sunday. He argued with Lawwell over tranfers again and wanted to prove a point. We have played poorly in several games this season but managed to scrape through due to BR makes a few changes but in this match he did nothing. 3 CB all playing within 5 yards of each other. Izzy running forward but not defending. Sinclair playing out of position on the right and Forrest, who has played RWB before, playing on the left. After 1 minute you could see that all hibs had to do was hit us on the wing. We could have played Ralston and Izzy and played 4 at the back. Brown sitting deep with Ntcham and McGregor further forward. Sincy and Forrest on the wings and eddy up top. BR didn't have to play the formation that he did...when he saw after 45 seconds that it wasn't working he could have changed it easily but chose not to. I just don't understand why....obviously I don't believe for 1 second that he threw the match in the sober light of day. I just don't understand the excuse of having players out injured. We could have played our same formation with the players we had.....still fucking annoying me!!

I don’t think Rogers would need to throw a game to show anyone that we need to improve our squad. If that is the case then a lot more people need to leave the club. It was more to do I think with him making an arse if it tactically and the players brought in being terrible on the day. We need to ensure we win the league. Dropping any points is not a good idea. It’s simply a bad set of tactics and players doing themselves no favours if they want to be a part of us going forward. I can see why you would think that though, so unbelievably awful we played.
 
How is it we the Celtic supporters can see this yet the management team who are on massive salaries cannot.I posted a comment after the hibs game similar to the point you are making Verdict regarding the massive wage bill.Larry has posted all the players,all 33 with a third of that amount hardly getting any game time and even when they do not making an impact. Its difficult as a supporter to decipher when players who havent played for months who dont make an impact on games are below the standard of playing for Celtic or just not match fit.Morgan and guys like Benyu and kouassi have not had a sustained run in the team.Mikey Johnstone had a run in the team had one bad game and was out.Yet Sinclair who has had so many poor performances plays regardless. BR needs to offload at least 7 players in january which by the way we wouldnt even notice.Bring in another CB(Not Mckenna) a right back who can get up and down the flank and defend. An attacking midfielder and at least another penalty box striker.No long term projects or an inexperienced player just a proven goal scorer.Hopefully we will have LG back after the winter break. So come on BR you are a tim like we are forget congerton you are the main man get the players in that we need.No more Hendry Gamboa Koussi Hayes Allen.We deserve better and until you trim the genepool PL will give you nothing.
 
How is it we the Celtic supporters can see this yet the management team who are on massive salaries cannot.

To be fair, this time last year I swore Jozo was twice the player that Boyata ever would be and this time two months ago I thought Christie looked like a poor man's Niall McGinn. Loads of fans probably agreed (and plenty more thought McGregor and Forrest were donkeys). I've only recently come to realise that Brendan knows more than me about football.

Still, I agree with the rest of your post:

Brendan, Sinclair seems to get infinite chances and it's high time you let other players try. I'd rather watch young Mikey learn from his mistakes than endure Sinclair's heartless showings.

Peter Lawell, it's a false economy not investing. Sensible fans aren't looking for financial doping in our club, but if it means winning leagues and qualifying for the CL then surely a mid-sized outlay on a right back who can run and a striker who can lead the line makes sense.
 

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