Proudly Scottish & Irish - Definitively European

[JimMc]

Be a good positive banner of historical and logical fact, one that would make the typical normal impartial viewer around the world think of Celtic positively. that is after all how many with an open mind would instantly think of the word Celtic anyway and do so generally positively, so perhaps Celtic FC should reinforce it loudly not hide from reality.

1888 PROUDLY SCOTTISH & IRISH - DEFINITIVELY EUROPEAN 1967​

Swap words around, for me Irish would come first but what ever has the most impact.
And one with the added bonus of being sure to really wind up the british nationalist extremist lowlifes who yesterday evening had a BNP SDL NF type banner displayed, one that was left in the gutters of Hampden. fiercely british - only intended to mean one thing and appeal to all hating british nationalist and little englander extremists. Possibly some less aware could take it as a positive, not knowing the extremes perversions of exclusiveness these oafs imagine.

personally only consider myself as Irish, but always delighted to go along with the sentiment for purpose of PR to benefit Celtic FC and fans.

Seen as they steal all our songs like the fields of Athenry (some of these brit oafs actually believe they sung it first!) and likewise pervert many an Irish emblem like the ancient Irish and Gaelic and prehistoric Ulster Red Hand, the symbol used by ancient Irish Clanns & the Tyrone GAA btw for those who did not know the symbol is Irish, not remotely british in origin.
british is credibly not much older than the usa American and then in reality a much later commonly used identity by comparison.

 

[Micmac]

Sorry to disagree with the message mate. I can't forget the treatment we received as a community in my earlier years. The snide sectarianism lives on within Scottish society and is routinely found in various social forums, bowling clubs golf clubs etc. My thanks, however, are extended to the members of the host nation who first pointed out to me the fact I and my kin were unwanted interlopers in their country. Scottish nationalism has found favour with many of our younger generations for good or ill. As the hold of the Catholic church is lessened, for various reasons, not least worldwide scandals of sexual abuse of children, peoples sense of Irishness diminishes. Yes Celtic are rightly an inclusive club ,and yes they have a Scottish dimension but British? Not for me not as a vehicle for a wind up or any other reason. What next? Poppies on our beloved hoops?????

 

[Micmac]

Definitely European has a racist flavour to it soory Jim but that's my take on it

 

[TartanTim]

I'M A Scot, born Glasgow 1964, I'm of Irish & English Ancestry my mum was from Glasgow & ma Da was from Liverpool.

 

[The Shamrock]

I always say I'm Scottish with Irish ancestry but I'm only British because it says so on my passport although I'm quite happy to be European.

 

[boab1916]

1888 PROUDLY CELTS - DEFINITIVELY EUROPEAN 1967

Be a good positive banner of historical and logical fact, one that would make the typical normal impartial viewer around the world think of Celtic positively. that is after all how many with an open mind would instantly think of the word Celtic anyway and do so generally positively, so perhaps Celtic FC should reinforce it loudly not hide from reality.

1888 PROUDLY SCOTTISH & IRISH - DEFINITIVELY EUROPEAN 1967​

Swap words around, for me Irish would come first but what ever has the most impact.
And one with the added bonus of being sure to really wind up the british nationalist extremist lowlifes who yesterday evening had a BNP SDL NF type banner displayed, one that was left in the gutters of Hampden. fiercely british - only intended to mean one thing and appeal to all hating british nationalist and little englander extremists. Possibly some less aware could take it as a positive, not knowing the extremes perversions of exclusiveness these oafs imagine.

personally only consider myself as Irish, but always delighted to go along with the sentiment for purpose of PR to benefit Celtic FC and fans.

Seen as they steal all our songs like the fields of Athenry (some of these brit oafs actually believe they sung it first!) and likewise pervert many an Irish emblem like the ancient Irish and Gaelic and prehistoric Ulster Red Hand, the symbol used by ancient Irish Clanns & the Tyrone GAA btw for those who did not know the symbol is Irish, not remotely british in origin.
british is credibly not much older than the usa American and then in reality a much later commonly used identity by comparison.

 

[TartanTim]

Never see myself as British, except for the passport. Don't see myself as European either

 

[JimMc]

Definitely European has a racist flavour to it soory Jim but that's my take on it

I never used the word Definitely, as it raises possible doubt, open to debate! not sure of any racist context of that word if used!! but like all words just a word that can have different meanings to who ever is reading.
Likely received as better and more positive than words like 'scum' put on recent celtic fans banners, how does that work when it is a word so commonly used by ' ' !

I am only suggesting a positive banner, one that does not concentrate on them, I stated a bonus by default not design!

Definitively is more just a factual reality, a description beyond any credible argument, a definitive fact is that Scotland is a part of Europe. That Celtic are a club that play in a European League and in European Competitions regularly, and if not for winning an early European Cup it is likely they would not have the global romantic appeal for many outside of Glasgow, same applies for being considered connected to both being Irish and Scottish.

I get the issues with Scotland for many Irish, the general treatment of the Irish, which was especially bad and overt in the Scotland of the recent living memory, where anti-Irish abuses was systemic in every walk of life and without any real avenue for complaint. Just had to put up with it or go! But those extreme days are gone! They never won!
The Irish did, because they did not just shut up and put up with it, or bow down or give up, they won rights many people take for granted today.
The Irish emigrants were the core if not foundations of ordinary peoples rights across the Island of Britain, which may never have had any rights of worth if it was not for Irish emigrants who just did not accept. The Irish were proudly at the very core of both movements that made real change, The Chartists and Unions gave people the idea for rights, not some BS magna carta utter myth nonsense or came courtesy of any of their wars, perverse notions promoted to and cherished by the most ignorant england/british nationalist oaf.

The Irish whilst sadly often part of crown empire building in other peoples lands, were also core at the same empires destruction and current supposed 'common' wealth 'joke status.

Sorry to disagree with the message mate. I can't forget the treatment we received as a community in my earlier years. The snide sectarianism lives on within Scottish society and is routinely found in various social forums, bowling clubs golf clubs etc. My thanks, however, are extended to the members of the host nation who first pointed out to me the fact I and my kin were unwanted interlopers in their country. Scottish nationalism has found favour with many of our younger generations for good or ill. As the hold of the Catholic church is lessened, for various reasons, not least worldwide scandals of sexual abuse of children, peoples sense of Irishness diminishes. Yes Celtic are rightly an inclusive club ,and yes they have a Scottish dimension but British? Not for me not as a vehicle for a wind up or any other reason. What next? Poppies on our beloved hoops?????

I know where you are coming from but never the less the Club itself describes itself as Scottish (of course not british there is no such credible thing as a british club or a recognized british league) with proud Irish roots /foundations /connections or what ever words they currently use when asked by a reporter.
.
that last part!
If Celtic fans don't take ownership of who they are and define a core, it will be defined for them! you might not have noticed the poppy is already approved on the hoops by the plc.
Another topic that one.

All well and good saying cliché words like inclusive, but they are meaningless word really. Unless of course you want to include and welcome british nationalists in the club and take the word literal.
All clubs need a identity core for purpose, otherwise it is meaningless, and perhaps purposely vague words are encouraged by the PLC who let's not forget were happy to not even pay a living wage to many celtic plc employees until encouraged.

Many People of different ethnic backgrounds and politics or religions and none, buy into Celtic,
Some if not many specifically do so because of the Irish and Scottish identities, because they see
Celtic as specifically not British and of the system that treats their own not so well.

 

[Micmac]

Sorry Jim but reading your post which says in bold letters ....definitely European...... I have to assume its part of your post. Your experience of sectarianism in modern society is obviously somewhat different from mine, for me it still stinks and although driven underground somewhat it remains a real obstacle to many who want to feel at ease in Scotland. As for buying into Celtic I couldn't comment I was born into the club as are all my children and grandchildren.
A final point Jim , can you tell me how many of the schools invited to participate in the grand opening of the Scottish par?lament were from denominational schools? Care to guess?
Sorry to appear so adversarial Jim, respect

 

[Maria]

I never used the word Definitely, as it raises possible doubt, open to debate! not sure of any racist context of that word if used!! but like all words just a word that can have different meanings to who ever is reading.
Likely received as better and more positive than words like 'scum' put on recent celtic fans banners, how does that work when it is a word so commonly used by ' ' !

I am only suggesting a positive banner, one that does not concentrate on them, I stated a bonus by default not design!

Definitively is more just a factual reality, a description beyond any credible argument, a definitive fact is that Scotland is a part of Europe. That Celtic are a club that play in a European League and in European Competitions regularly, and if not for winning an early European Cup it is likely they would not have the global romantic appeal for many outside of Glasgow, same applies for being considered connected to both being Irish and Scottish.

I get the issues with Scotland for many Irish, the general treatment of the Irish, which was especially bad and overt in the Scotland of the recent living memory, where anti-Irish abuses was systemic in every walk of life and without any real avenue for complaint. Just had to put up with it or go! But those extreme days are gone! They never won!
The Irish did, because they did not just shut up and put up with it, or bow down or give up, they won rights many people take for granted today.
The Irish emigrants were the core if not foundations of ordinary peoples rights across the Island of Britain, which may never have had any rights of worth if it was not for Irish emigrants who just did not accept. The Irish were proudly at the very core of both movements that made real change, The Chartists and Unions gave people the idea for rights, not some BS magna carta utter myth nonsense or came courtesy of any of their wars, perverse notions promoted to and cherished by the most ignorant england/british nationalist oaf.

The Irish whilst sadly often part of crown empire building in other peoples lands, were also core at the same empires destruction and current supposed 'common' wealth 'joke status.



I know where you are coming from but never the less the Club itself describes itself as Scottish (of course not british there is no such credible thing as a british club or a recognized british league) with proud Irish roots /foundations /connections or what ever words they currently use when asked by a reporter.
.
that last part!
If Celtic fans don't take ownership of who they are and define a core, it will be defined for them! you might not have noticed the poppy is already approved on the hoops by the plc.
Another topic that one.

All well and good saying cliché words like inclusive, but they are meaningless word really. Unless of course you want to include and welcome british nationalists in the club and take the word literal.
All clubs need a identity core for purpose, otherwise it is meaningless, and perhaps purposely vague words are encouraged by the PLC who let's not forget were happy to not even pay a living wage to many celtic plc employees until encouraged.

Many People of different ethnic backgrounds and politics or religions and none, buy into Celtic,
Some if not many specifically do so because of the Irish and Scottish identities, because they see
Celtic as specifically not British and of the system that treats their own not so well.

I get what your saying Jim, anything but british.

Me i would be fkn north korean before that

 

[Spherical Planet]

The experience will vary from region-to-region and from individual-to-individual.

My parents were both natives of Ireland, but left when they were young. Their "Irishness" became diluted through time as they had to adapt to their new environment. It should also be noted that their own experiences of Ireland were not altogether positive. There were underlying reasons why they and their families had to migrate.

Both were proud of their heritage, but both identified flaws in Ireland too.

I'm Scottish by birth and I feel Scottish in many aspects of my life. I am also very proud of my association with Ireland, but as I don't contribute in any meaningful way (taxes, economy, etc), then I feel that I have forfeited my right to be regarded as Irish.

I believe that I am extremely selective when describing myself as Irish and i'm ashamed to say that it is more a banner of convenience, as and when the circumstances dictate.

In response to the original post, I don't believe that, from a cultural perspective, anyone can be anything definitively.

I believe that we can be definitive in our religious choices, political choices, sexual preferences and personal tastes, however I don't strongly feel that in a changing population (with a varied range of cultural identities) that there is a definitive "Scottish" type.

It is one of the features of supporting Celtic that I fully embrace. As a club, all are welcome regardless of colour, creed, or culture.

I'm sure i've probably contradicted myself, but that is a common feature in my characteristic.

I hope that I could be regarded as a progressive "Scot" with an accepted Irish heritage and identity.

I will state definitively though.....I never have, and likely never will, feel British.

 

[Shadow2]

The fact we're called Celtic in the first place was to reflect the club's Irish and Scottish roots, borne of 2 Celtic nations. I as a Scot with Irish ancestry fully embrace that notion and take pride in it and that was ultimately the goal of Brother Walfrid and his fellow founders, to bring together 2 Celtic peoples who shared a long and intertwined history that went back countless centuries to create a force for good.

I agree with Jim, we should take great pride in that shared heritage and what was borne out of it CELTIC FOOTBALL CLUB!

I get the reluctance of some to fully embrace the whole Scottish element given the history of anti-Irish sentiment in Scotland but in reality that always emanated from the 'Brit Nat/Unionist Scot' types who held the reigns of power in a variety of Scottish institutions, frequented various lodges and aligned themselves with a certain other football club I don't really think it's a fair reflection on wider Scottish society. With regards to the opening of the Scottish parliament and who was invited to participate let's not forget it was those very same 'Brit Nat/Unionist Scots' and their Westminster friends who created that parliament, thinking devolution would kill Scottish independence stone dead, who also organised the opening ceremony. If denominational schools weren't invited to participate then that should reflect badly on them not on Scotland as a whole.

HH.

 

[Strummer]

I am 100% Scots. My great grandparents moved from the Highlands down to Glasgow. Whilst I have no Irish ancestry I embrace our clubs Irish roots and those of lots of my fellow Celts. Having said that, when its Scotland v Ireland in any sport, I want Scotland to win, despite those bastards at the SFA. I like Ireland to beat everyone else tho.
Politically, I'd love to live in an independent confident Scotland as a member in the European Union and still hope it will come to pass. Hail Hail everyone. ?????????

 

[Maria]

The experience will vary from region-to-region and from individual-to-individual.

My parents were both natives of Ireland, but left when they were young. Their "Irishness" became diluted through time as they had to adapt to their new environment. It should also be noted that their own experiences of Ireland were not altogether positive. There were underlying reasons why they and their families had to migrate.

Both were proud of their heritage, but both identified flaws in Ireland too.

I'm Scottish by birth and I feel Scottish in many aspects of my life. I am also very proud of my association with Ireland, but as I don't contribute in any meaningful way (taxes, economy, etc), then I feel that I have forfeited my right to be regarded as Irish.

I believe that I am extremely selective when describing myself as Irish and i'm ashamed to say that it is more a banner of convenience, as and when the circumstances dictate.

In response to the original post, I don't believe that, from a cultural perspective, anyone can be anything definitively.

I believe that we can be definitive in our religious choices, political choices, sexual preferences and personal tastes, however I don't strongly feel that in a changing population (with a varied range of cultural identities) that there is a definitive "Scottish" type.

It is one of the features of supporting Celtic that I fully embrace. As a club, all are welcome regardless of colour, creed, or culture.

I'm sure i've probably contradicted myself, but that is a common feature in my characteristic.

I hope that I could be regarded as a progressive "Scot" with an accepted Irish heritage and identity.

I will state definitively though.....I never have, and likely never will, feel British.

You pal are a hunskelper extraordinairre.

Hat tip to you. Respect HH