THE MINISTER FOR COCAINE

All drugs including alcohol need to be treated as a public health issue and not a criminalised one. The money wasted locking people up could and should be reinvested in helping people. It is literally hundreds of billions worldwide, with the only people benefitting are gangsters.

We know people have always taken drugs, from our earliest days of mad plants that put us into a trance like state, to mad brews of early beer to get that high we all still do today.

To fight to try and stop it, is as futile as hoping you will win the Euro Millions every week for a year. Big Pharma ensured most of the drugs once legal where criminalised by buying politicians to enact laws that ensured they made billions.

Every year we hear of a bad batch of some drug that kills maybe half a dozen people and it’s headline news. Last night’s report that 22 people a week die of problems with alcohol didn’t raise an eyebrow. Now imagine, even in our wee country, if we diverted all the money putting users of drugs in jail and used it to help people with drug problems, and obviously the biggest killer, booze, how many of those 22 people might not have died?

The social costs of alcohol are enormous too as we all know, take a trip into any A+E department and see the consequences of drink. The violence. Then ask yourself when you ever noticed the result of a fight that broke out when people were having a puff?

Or people starting fighting when dancing whilst having an E?

The next time you pass someone who is obviously having drug problems, look at the person there who is suffering from their drug, alcohol and tell me whatvthevdifference is for them. One will be that whilst a person addicted to alcohol he irvshe can go into anywhere to get their fix without fear of getting jailed and the other needs to get involved with dealers.

These addictions cost a Kings ransom to deal with for our NHS, for people addicted to heroin the major cause of hospital visits isn’t the heroin, it’s the infections people contract from the dodgy cutting of the drug by the gangs who control it. People of limited means who have to have their fix resort to stealing, robbing and prostitution to pay for it. Again a social and economic cost. If it was legal and available through health centres as part of a programme to help them beat it that wasn’t corrupted by other chemicals then the associated problems don’t happen.

It won’t work for everybody but at least those that can’t stop are helped to minimise the devastating effects rather than jailing them.

The drug cartels lose their monopoly and access to the billions. We save billions by recognising we are pissing in the wind and the money saved could be invested to help, rather than punish those afflicted.

Weed could be sold and raise millions in taxes. Look at Portugal and see how they have improved every aspect of the problem they had before they decriminalised.

The next time you see a “junkie” and you may be inclined to shake your head in disgust have a wee think about the last time you were drunk, nippy, argumentative or worse and ask yourself, who the fuck am I to look down on somebody for taking a drug? I do it every week. Mine causes more problems, costs more to mop up its impact and kills a hundred times more people than any that poor soul might have taken.

I have had a couple of pals die in the last year through drink before their time. It doesn’t make me want alcohol banned, but I would like to see resources wasted on the war on drugs used to make peace with them. To help those who have a predisposition to become addicted and to have services that help them and their families and in the end us all.

When people are sick we help them. We shouldn’t jail them or drive them into the hands of crime. How many women are forced into sex work through their addiction? How many people are killed or beaten through trying to control the trade? The criminals don’t pay tax. They get rich and grow their empires. Tell me how a system that rewards criminals and criminalises people who have problems. A person who has problems with drugs is an addict. A person who is an alcoholic is an addict too. If we have any compassion we deal with the human cost and help. We need resources to do this and the way we deal with this problem sees us spending far greater amounts in a futile war that was never going to be won for the benefit of special interests, criminal and legit, the victims are a footnote. It’s their fault. They are this or that. It’s a way of dehumanising them to accept their fate. That to me is shameful and not only does it cast them adrift, it cuts part of our own humanity adrift with it. And if we think about it, we know that’s an uncomfortable truth we have probably all participated in. It’s makes it easier to look the other way. I want a country that doesn’t look the other way. That is defined by how we treat those among us that have problems. That helps them. And if we can destroy the criminal gangs, whose tool is violence and intimidation along the way, then that’s fine by me too.

Portugal shows a more compassionate approach can work in reducing the scale if the problem by accepting it’s always going to be with us. The war on drugs doesn’t. It’s futile, innefective, doesn’t deal with the problem, exasserbates it by giving criminals a niche, diverts massive resources that could be better spent and changes absolutely nothing.

What’s that old definition of insanity?
To keep doing the same thing and expect a different outcome. We need to ask whose outcomes are being served? The people suffering, or those making a fortune out of their suffering, then tell me again how that is right?
I'm not disagreeing, but it's all relative to how many people are participating in these activities.

What percentage of people consume alcohol to excess?

What percentage of people are addicted to Class A drugs?

What percentage of people drink excessively and take Class A drugs?

The numbers are compelling, but you have to look at them in pro-rata form to identify which is the most likely to cause death.

The fact is, that excessive alcohol consumption, drug addiction, poor diet, nicotine addiction and poor overall lifestyle choices are all responsible for an inordinate amount premature deaths in this country.
 
I'm not disagreeing, but it's all relative to how many people are participating in these activities.

What percentage of people consume alcohol to excess?

What percentage of people are addicted to Class A drugs?

What percentage of people drink excessively and take Class A drugs?

The numbers are compelling, but you have to look at them in pro-rata form to identify which is the most likely to cause death.

The fact is, that excessive alcohol consumption, drug addiction, poor diet, nicotine addiction and poor overall lifestyle choices are all responsible for an inordinate amount premature deaths in this country.

It’s not about how many people are affected, it’s about not compounding the problem and having the resources to better deal with it. Lifestyle choices do have an enormous impact but when was the last time you read about someone in court for being fat?

It’s a physical and mental condituon, but we separate them out. Why? It’s a question of trying to reduce the impact by public health responses rather than criminal ones.

No one has been charged with developing diabetes, heart issues. Problems with weight that has a huge economic and social impact. We need a different approach and I would encourage everyone to look at the Portugal approach. There is no panacea, no magic bullet, but what we are doing just isn’t working and it’s costing billions, still, in the knowledge that it’s futile.

The horse has been dead for decades. Let it rest in peace and the nstead try to prevent people joining it. All the countries that have gone down this road have managed it. So could we.
 
It’s not about how many people are affected, it’s about not compounding the problem and having the resources to better deal with it. Lifestyle choices do have an enormous impact but when was the last time you read about someone in court for being fat?

It’s a physical and mental condituon, but we separate them out. Why? It’s a question of trying to reduce the impact by public health responses rather than criminal ones.

No one has been charged with developing diabetes, heart issues. Problems with weight that has a huge economic and social impact. We need a different approach and I would encourage everyone to look at the Portugal approach. There is no panacea, no magic bullet, but what we are doing just isn’t working and it’s costing billions, still, in the knowledge that it’s futile.

The horse has been dead for decades. Let it rest in peace and the nstead try to prevent people joining it. All the countries that have gone down this road have managed it. So could we.
Again, can't disagree, TV1

Good points well presented
 
As an alcoholic in recovery, i can tell you that whilst minimum pricing has come in it won’t stop an alcoholic getting drink they will just forego everything else.

But the promising thing is that others and the kids coming up just won’t buy as much or as often due to price reducing their chances of alcoholism.

Its not what you drink though or the quantities its how it makes you feel that should determine if your an alcoholic.

Wake up with the fear?
Get drunk on the anticipation of having a drink?


But when you start planking drink and cant stop at just one then you need to ask if drink is causing problems in your life.

Pricing won’t stop alcoholics drinking but it reduces consumption and that will have positive health impacts. Alcoholism is an illness. Why someone can drink the same amount as you, yet develop a dependancy they find difficult to control. But for people with a drug problem that us alcohol they don’t go to jail or pay a fine, have a criminal record that hinders employability, in short makes the sense of hopelessness more intense.

People need help and support and that costs. Treating addiction as a health issue is the only way to deal with it. Addiction to a drug including alcohol won’t be cured by pricing, but it is only made worse when you get criminalised for it and out in jail at a cost of circa £4K a week. Imagine what could be done with that money to help the person?
 
Gove as Education Secretary introduced policy to have teacher's struck off if it could be proven that they'd ever used drugs.

Never knew that.
Ffs that's going to be a blow for the future of the creative arts.
There will be a black market now with the Art, music and drama department bidding for vials of clean student piss! ?

Reminded me of the first 50s of this
 
Never knew that.
Ffs that's going to be a blow for the future of the creative arts.
There will be a black market now with the Art, music and drama department bidding for vials of clean student piss! ?

Reminded me of the first 50s of this
Stuff is quite literally liquid gold in some American States BBB.

There's an actual black market in stolen piss jugs.
 
I'm not disagreeing, but it's all relative to how many people are participating in these activities.

What percentage of people consume alcohol to excess?

What percentage of people are addicted to Class A drugs?

What percentage of people drink excessively and take Class A drugs?

The numbers are compelling, but you have to look at them in pro-rata form to identify which is the most likely to cause death.

The fact is, that excessive alcohol consumption, drug addiction, poor diet, nicotine addiction and poor overall lifestyle choices are all responsible for an inordinate amount premature deaths in this country.


I used to fairly enjoy the snow. A wee bit too fond off it for 20 years. Very very regularly but not addicted to that just liked it.
 
I used to fairly enjoy the snow. A wee bit too fond off it for 20 years. Very very regularly but not addicted to that just liked it.
There was a mad period during the 90's where it was just social.

I never got the notion for it myself, which I thank the Lord for.

I've got a bit of an addiction addiction and I would have been another one of the statistics.
 
It’s not about how many people are affected, it’s about not compounding the problem and having the resources to better deal with it. Lifestyle choices do have an enormous impact but when was the last time you read about someone in court for being fat?

It’s a physical and mental condituon, but we separate them out. Why? It’s a question of trying to reduce the impact by public health responses rather than criminal ones.

No one has been charged with developing diabetes, heart issues. Problems with weight that has a huge economic and social impact. We need a different approach and I would encourage everyone to look at the Portugal approach. There is no panacea, no magic bullet, but what we are doing just isn’t working and it’s costing billions, still, in the knowledge that it’s futile.

The horse has been dead for decades. Let it rest in peace and the nstead try to prevent people joining it. All the countries that have gone down this road have managed it. So could we.
Aye and stop eating sausages answer bam
 
There was a mad period during the 90's where it was just social.

I never got the notion for it myself, which I thank the Lord for.

I've got a bit of an addiction addiction and I would have been another one of the statistics.
Ah the 90's SP. I was hanging out with a load of wannabe and wouldgoontobe TV people. The parties fuelled by shitloads of coke still send shivers down my back. A house full of those drug fuelled egos all bumming their load ten to the dozen was too much for me to take or compete with. I ended up mainlining smack just to be different. Fortunately saw the errors in my thinking reasonably soon and negative repercussions were few. I now have little time for cokeheads but do a lot of rehab work with heroin addicts. ??
 
Ah the 90's SP. I was hanging out with a load of wannabe and wouldgoontobe TV people. The parties fuelled by shitloads of coke still send shivers down my back. A house full of those drug fuelled egos all bumming their load ten to the dozen was too much for me to take or compete with. I ended up mainlining smack just to be different. Fortunately saw the errors in my thinking reasonably soon and negative repercussions were few. I now have little time for cokeheads but do a lot of rehab work with heroin addicts. ??
Think how many hundreds of thousands of young folk have taken a blast of something just to fit in, Lemon?

Peer pressure is one of the main contributors to heavy drug use and for a few unfortunate folk, that one blast is all it takes.

Coke has still got this "cool vibe" among the upwardly mobile classes, but it's just another stepping stone to addiction.

Horse is a different animal.......it's development, environment and culture that starts that cycle, for the most part. I don't think those boys and girls consciously set out on that lifestyle and I'll forever thank fellas like yourself for seeing beyond addiction and understanding those other factors.
 
Ach I am paid for doing it SP. I have very few talents to sell so I make my fortune from other peoples misery just like the dealer. I do though have a deep mistrust of the wealthy and I need the working classes fit for the revolution. ??
And so you should be paid, Lemon!

Successive governments have thrown hundreds of millions at it without a clue as to the causes of addiction are, or what the out comes would be post-recovery.

You're clean........for now, but we'll throw you back to the same place, with the same people, and the same circumstances that got you here in the first place.

And for all that money being spent, none of it went to creating jobs or educational/retraining opportunities. It went only to exacerbating the problem further.

You know better than anyone, Lemon. Rehab is a lifelong exercise and it's about understanding how these things happened and how to avoid them in future.

I am revolting, Lemon.........I might even get involved in a bit of revolution too.
 
Aw look at you, poopsy........only a week late to the party.

Did it take you that long to sharpen your rapier-like wit, spoofster?

daft must have had birthday sex wie stupid, doop-doop and you were what dropped oot a few months later.

Cheers buddy.

Ow look at d hypocrit. he n d mini gang will b tellin others 2 not b personal.
expect nothing less from a sad old broken rocket who lives all alone wiv a cat. even d cat dont trust him keeps her back 2 d wall
 
Ow look at d hypocrit. he n d mini gang will b tellin others 2 not b personal.
expect nothing less from a sad old broken rocket who lives all alone wiv a cat. even d cat dont trust him keeps her back 2 d wall
Hahahahahaha the shitbucket appears!!!!

Alright there, popster, how's tricks?

The only thing that lives alone is the single brain cell in your napper, shitshoveller.
 
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