We Really Do Have To Talk About VAR

[Imatim]

VAR - They’re “at it” and we all know they are.

They have conspired to work out ways of manipulating VAR to suit their agenda and it’s working. It hasn’t cost us points or games yet, but in time it will. Are we going to wait for that to happen?

If those on VAR don’t feel like highlighting infringements - They don’t. No video evidence of the Souter handball in the penalty box made available even though the commentator said it would be forthcoming. Why?

Lines are being drawn by VAR that are highly suspicious to say the least. Why is this not being challenged?

Alistair Johnson was clotheslined by Diamonde and got booked for it into the bargain. No VAR intervention? Why?

Add your own observations to this.

So what to do?

Former SFA referees criticise the 'baffling' use of VAR during Celtic vs Rangers game

The use of VAR to disallow Kyogo Furuhashi's goal against Rangers has been heavily criticised by two former SFA referees.

www.67hailhail.com

 

[50 Shades of Green]

OK...

Back to Calmacs goal at the weekend, 1min or so before he scored there is a claim for handball, but play continues and eventually the goal is scored before the ball goes out of play..

The commentry team tell us just before the goal that the handball has been looked at and the arm is at the players side so no pen will be awarded... All fair so far.... Except a hun totally wipes out a Celtic player in the box at the same incident and its either missed or ignored by the ref... But VAR must have seen it and imho its a straight red and they should have informed the ref after the goal of the incident... But its been ignored.. And in my opinion thats why Sky never showed a replay of the incident...

This should be added to the litany of offences against VAR if and when Celtic get round to complaining about it..

 

[Bridie Bhoy]

OK...

Back to Calmacs goal at the weekend, 1min or so before he scored there is a claim for handball, but play continues and eventually the goal is scored before the ball goes out of play..

The commentry team tell us just before the goal that the handball has been looked at and the arm is at the players side so no pen will be awarded... All fair so far.... Except a hun totally wipes out a Celtic player in the box at the same incident and its either missed or ignored by the ref... But VAR must have seen it and imho its a straight red and they should have informed the ref after the goal of the incident... But its been ignored.. And in my opinion thats why Sky never showed a replay of the incident...

This should be added to the litany of offences against VAR if and when Celtic get round to complaining about it..

This was even reviewed by that gobshite on Sky's refwatch thing on Monday. Dermot Gallagher was effusive with praise for Beaton and VAR for being brilliant and deciding that the handball was definitely not a penalty. But as you say, Kuhn (I think) was completely wiped out illegally from behind as he shot, but this was totally ignored by him. And no mention of the flying haymaker into AJ's face either!

 

[lennono]

Watching the highlights last night on sportscene. When they showed the 'offside' line for Kyogo's goal(first one) They showed the line at an angle. Why not show the line at right angles from the touchline. Then that way. it is easier to say if it was offside as you get a clearer view. It felt as though they decided to show the viewers the line at an angle, as they weren't sure if he was actually offside.

 

[Richybhoy]

Sky are part of the problem. They have had an anti Celtic agenda for years.
They go along with the survival lie and allow their sevvie minded employees to tell lies without correcting them. The deliberate mistranslation of what that Colombian clown was saying was a direct attack by a Sky employee on Celtic.
It’s not the first time that sevvie who attacked AJ has attacked Celtic players without getting punished or his cowardly attacks given proper coverage on either Sky or BBC. If the sevvie Diomonde (diabolical mair like) acted like that in the EPL Sky and BBC would highlight his forearm smashes and cowardly elbows to the back of the head. Not in Scotland though.
Their refusal to highlight the shocking inconsistencies in Celtic games v other games by the same Ref/Var team. One week a high boot in the face (Scales v Motherwell) is a free kick to Celtic and no cards to Motherwell, the next week a high boot with no actual contact to the face is a straight Red Card for Celtic
None of us are surprised at the way VAR is being used. Every single one of us said it would be used for the benefit of Sevco and to the detriment of Celtic and anyone playing Sevco. That’s exactly what has happened.
As long as Celtic and all the other teams, who are victims of sevvie supporting Ref/VAR officials, stay silent this will continue to happen.
It’s not as if there is a lack of evidence. Their blatant cheating is regularly filmed from multiple angles but very rarely (never!) called out.
Will anyone speak up? No. Why? I have no idea why Scottish football has decided to meekly accept blatant cheating by match officials.

 

[Imatim]

Sky are part of the problem. They have had an anti Celtic agenda for years.
They go along with the survival lie and allow their sevvie minded employees to tell lies without correcting them. The deliberate mistranslation of what that Colombian clown was saying was a direct attack by a Sky employee on Celtic.
It’s not the first time that sevvie who attacked AJ has attacked Celtic players without getting punished or his cowardly attacks given proper coverage on either Sky or BBC. If the sevvie Diomonde (diabolical mair like) acted like that in the EPL Sky and BBC would highlight his forearm smashes and cowardly elbows to the back of the head. Not in Scotland though.
Their refusal to highlight the shocking inconsistencies in Celtic games v other games by the same Ref/Var team. One week a high boot in the face (Scales v Motherwell) is a free kick to Celtic and no cards to Motherwell, the next week a high boot with no actual contact to the face is a straight Red Card for Celtic
None of us are surprised at the way VAR is being used. Every single one of us said it would be used for the benefit of Sevco and to the detriment of Celtic and anyone playing Sevco. That’s exactly what has happened.
As long as Celtic and all the other teams, who are victims of sevvie supporting Ref/VAR officials, stay silent this will continue to happen.
It’s not as if there is a lack of evidence. Their blatant cheating is regularly filmed from multiple angles but very rarely (never!) called out.
Will anyone speak up? No. Why? I have no idea why Scottish football has decided to meekly accept blatant cheating by match officials.

Does the answer lie with UEFA?

Do Celtic sites have an obligation to do what they can to continually highlight the corruption we are witnessing on a regular basis? There’s abundant video and statistical evidence available to highlight what’s going on, isn’t there?

Should we be lobbying the club to take stock of what’s clearly going on, and seek that they demand that the SFA and their officials answer the pertinent questions that need answering?

There must be something that can be done to bring scrutiny and transparency to Scottish Football, surely?

Any suggestions?…

 

[Richybhoy]

Not sure what the answer is Imatim. Before dealing with it we have to acknowledge that it’s happening. Unfortunately the people who should be shining a light on this, the media, are part of the problem.

 

[Lubos left peg]

Watching the highlights last night on sportscene. When they showed the 'offside' line for Kyogo's goal(first one) They showed the line at an angle. Why not show the line at right angles from the touchline. Then that way. it is easier to say if it was offside as you get a clearer view. It felt as though they decided to show the viewers the line at an angle, as they weren't sure if he was actually offside.

View attachment 26635

It's already been stated that the lines are hand drawn.
Someone also zoomed in and put the lines drawn from the sevco player to the offside line beside the line drawn from Kuhn to the offside line and you can clearly see that the line from the hun is diagonal going back the way and Kuhns line is straight down.
It it also clear to see from the lines on the pitch that Kuhn was onside. Dallas cheated. It wasn't a mistake, he made sure that the goal was offside.
Please remember that the huns started well and were putting us under pressure at this point. Dallas was not to know that their bottle would crash after the goal. He saw his team on top and wanted to make sure they stayed there.

 

[Brimcbhoy]

The rest of Scottish Fitba are fed up with us winning everything and can't see why we should be moaning. So we will get zero support from them.
Same with the media.

 

[Richybhoy]

Does the answer lie with UEFA?

Do Celtic sites have an obligation to do what they can to continually highlight the corruption we are witnessing on a regular basis? There’s abundant video and statistical evidence available to highlight what’s going on, isn’t there?

Should we be lobbying the club to take stock of what’s clearly going on, and seek that they demand that the SFA and their officials answer the pertinent questions that need answering?

There must be something that can be done to bring scrutiny and transparency to Scottish Football, surely?

Any suggestions?…

The wife keeps telling me ,if this was happening in an American sport fans and/or shareholders would launch a class action lawsuit against the relevant governing sporting organisation.
The cheating can get teams relegated. Refs stealing points off teams who desperately need them. Blatant Penalties not given, soft penalties given to Sevco all steal points. These teams might have survived if penalties were awarded (or not awarded to Sevco) Guys are getting their wages cut due to relegation and points bonuses are missed out on because Sevco must not be allowed to lose or draw.
They are stealing points and stealing bonus payments from players.
But still the silence from the victims is deafening.
It’s while we are winning that we should call it out. Can’t accuse winners of being bitter losers (like the sevvies).

 

[Lubos left peg]

Can I also point out that I don't actually blame the refs (shock).
I know for a fact that if I was refereeing a Celtic v Sevco game that I would give them fuck all, as is my hatred for them. Every time a Celtic player fell over in the box I'd award a penalty, even if there was no hun near him. Meanwhile, if CCV committed a knee high challenge on Dossers, in the box, I'd book the hun for diving, even if the bone was sticking out his leg. Sevco would never score a goal against us. Every single time they did, I'd find fault with it.
My point being, it is almost impossible, in the Scottish football climate, to be impartial if you support one of these teams l, as most of the time it goes deeper than football.
This fixture carries not only politics but religion. 2 of the most divisive things in society.
That is why we CANNOT have huns, or Celtic fans for that matter, refereeing these games.
And the SFA and Scottish media and anyone else who thinks that these guys can rise above it and be impartial are delusional.

 

[Imatim]

Would it be worthwhile for us to have a dedicated thread on here, with definitive evidence of all the cheating we know is going on, with the intent of lobbying the club to take action?

We could add a host of other things to this thread where they are seen to be cheating from other places as we find them. I’m certain a distinctly odious pattern would emerge if we did.

Lubo has already stated how Dallas manipulated lines to cheat us out of a legitimate goal. This is the type of thing that needs to be highlighted and exposed imo and things we should be demanding answers to.

I’m thinking if we were to do this and collect a substantial amount of clear evidence of the cheating and corruption that is regularly happening we could raise these matters through a shareholder(s) writing to the Board demanding they act to protect the interests of the shareholders as they have a fiduciary duty to do so. I know a shareholder who would be willing to do this.

What’s your thoughts fellow Celts?…

 

[Imatim]

The wife keeps telling me ,if this was happening in an American sport fans and/or shareholders would launch a class action lawsuit against the relevant governing sporting organisation.
The cheating can get teams relegated. Refs stealing points off teams who desperately need them. Blatant Penalties not given, soft penalties given to Sevco all steal points. These teams might have survived if penalties were awarded (or not awarded to Sevco) Guys are getting their wages cut due to relegation and points bonuses are missed out on because Sevco must not be allowed to lose or draw.
They are stealing points and stealing bonus payments from players.
But still the silence from the victims is deafening.
It’s while we are winning that we should call it out. Can’t accuse winners of being bitter losers (like the sevvies).

Excellent points there…

 

[Miktim]

Would it be worthwhile for us to have a dedicated thread on here, with definitive evidence of all the cheating we know is going on, with the intent of lobbying the club to take action?

We could add a host of other things to this thread where they are seen to be cheating from other places as we find them. I’m certain a distinctly odious pattern would emerge if we did.

Lubo has already stated how Dallas manipulated lines to cheat us out of a legitimate goal. This is the type of thing that needs to be highlighted and exposed imo and things we should be demanding answers to.

I’m thinking if we were to do this and collect a substantial amount of clear evidence of the cheating and corruption that is regularly happening we could raise these matters through a shareholder(s) writing to the Board demanding they act to protect the interests of the shareholders as they have a fiduciary duty to do so. I know a shareholder who would be willing to do this.

What’s your thoughts fellow Celts?…

Great idea imatim

 

[Bridie Bhoy]

Would it be worthwhile for us to have a dedicated thread on here, with definitive evidence of all the cheating we know is going on, with the intent of lobbying the club to take action?

We could add a host of other things to this thread where they are seen to be cheating from other places as we find them. I’m certain a distinctly odious pattern would emerge if we did.

Lubo has already stated how Dallas manipulated lines to cheat us out of a legitimate goal. This is the type of thing that needs to be highlighted and exposed imo and things we should be demanding answers to.

I’m thinking if we were to do this and collect a substantial amount of clear evidence of the cheating and corruption that is regularly happening we could raise these matters through a shareholder(s) writing to the Board demanding they act to protect the interests of the shareholders as they have a fiduciary duty to do so. I know a shareholder who would be willing to do this.

What’s your thoughts fellow Celts?…

I thought that was the purpose of the Honest Mistakes thread?

 

[Imatim]

I thought that was the purpose of the Honest Mistakes thread?

If we can perhaps agree that we collectively need to do something about how VAR is being manipulated, and that the Honest Mistakes thread is the place to post these relevant issues, then what do you think about asking WC to make that particular thread a sticky on the Noise.

That would keep VAR and the corruption we constantly witness in high focus and a priority issue.

What do you and everyone else think?…

 

[Lubos left peg]

I think it's a great idea....but....and I understand this might sound strange, I don't believe Celtic fans have as much power to force change as all other fans of other clubs in the league do.
It's them we need to get involved in this debate. We need that debate to be changed from a Celtic Sevco issue to a Scottish football issue, a perception the Scottish media have created for a good reason.
The Celtic board have shown over the years that they don't really care what we think. Celtic fans and bloggers have been highlighting the corruption in the game for as long as I can remember. And the Celtic board have continuously ignored the mountain of evidence. The reason for this is that if 10,000 Celtic fans decided, tomorrow, to boycott the club (extreme, I know) until there was change, 10,000 fans would be waiting in the wings to take their place. The board know this.
I genuinely believe that it wasn't our club who stopped Sevco parachuting into the premiership in 2012. Our board would have allowed it in a heartbeat. It was the outrage from the "smaller" clubs fans that forced their clubs to vote against it, in turn causing our board to do the same. It wasn't our board standing outside the stadium and taking on Doncasters "Armageddon" comments...it was the guys from Dundee United and the likes taking on that fight.
If the fans of other clubs in the league start pressuring their boards, that's when we will see change. They haven't got 10,000 extra fans waiting in the wings to snap up seats and merchandise.
We need our bloggers to contact their bloggers to try to start a movement that involves everyone. It's not a fight we can carry on our own.....

 

[Brimcbhoy]

I can feel a thread merge coming on.

 

[Magnificent 7]

The problem will always be how to prove that these peepul are corrupt.
We can clearly see it but plenty others will argue/ debate the same incidents and say the decisions made were justified or correct.
E.G. Yer man on Sky on Ref watch regularly reaffirms dodgy decisions as good decisions.

The laws of the game seem to be quoted when decisions are challenged to quash any objections. These laws seem to change with impunity.

Manufactured stats are produced to show VAR is favourable to us and gleefully reported as such by a corrupt SMSM.

You could go on .....but as has been stated VAR is not the specific problem it is how it is used and by whom and that is the biggest issue that would need to be proven against a backdrop of sustained authorative bias that is ingrained in Scottish Football unfortunately.
Its difficult to see how that is gonna change.
I would agree that we cannot say nothing and the club need to demand Gollum and the LRA are given as hard a time as possible and taken to task permanently.

Would be good to have a fan media youtube blog that was focused on SPFL VAR watch with a representative Fan from each club assessing Var weekly independently and collectively.

Perhaps this would over the course of the seasons duration allow for all the clubs to see that one club is benefiting considerably more than any other and the fact that it appears to be an unbiased view may get the buy in required to take the authorities to task.
Would take a bit of organising but just a thought.

 

[Imatim]

The problem will always be how to prove that these peepul are corrupt.
We can clearly see it but plenty others will argue/ debate the same incidents and say the decisions made were justified or correct.
E.G. Yer man on Sky on Ref watch regularly reaffirms dodgy decisions as good decisions.

The laws of the game seem to be quoted when decisions are challenged to quash any objections. These laws seem to change with impunity.

Manufactured stats are produced to show VAR is favourable to us and gleefully reported as such by a corrupt SMSM.

You could go on .....but as has been stated VAR is not the specific problem it is how it is used and by whom and that is the biggest issue that would need to be proven against a backdrop of sustained authorative bias that is ingrained in Scottish Football unfortunately.
Its difficult to see how that is gonna change.
I would agree that we cannot say nothing and the club need to demand Gollum and the LRA are given as hard a time as possible and taken to task permanently.

Would be good to have a fan media youtube blog that was focused on SPFL VAR watch with a representative Fan from each club assessing Var weekly independently and collectively.

Perhaps this would over the course of the seasons duration allow for all the clubs to see that one club is benefiting considerably more than any other and the fact that it appears to be an unbiased view may get the buy in required to take the authorities to task.
Would take a bit of organising but just a thought.

If only 1 Celtic site on YouTube or the like, ran with a dedicated VAR segment, updating and highlighting the clear and obvious cheating on a regular basis as part of their programme, it would keep the spotlight continuously on the corruption that is endemic in Scottish Football.

They could call it something like “VAR Watch” - “Cheating on steroids”…..or…..”The Ludge Decides” …..or add yer own caption…