Celtic directors bonus plans & how Peter Lawwell can personally compete with the EPL

JimMc

JimMc

Well-known member
Peter Lawwell to receive £2.3 million bonus at New Year for his performance over last 2 years .

Anyone read enough of the PLC accounts or in the know enough to know if any Directors bonus is tied to a specific(s) target turnover or profits?
Are there any tiered scales for example - achieve this amount in a period and get this reward - in simple terms!

Or anyone been present at any previous share holders meeting to know if any question were raised re the Executive Long Term Incentive Plan (“ELTIP”) and possible concerns?
Of course nothing will have yet been asked specifically re the £2,296,000 paid to Peter Lawell on 31 Dec 2018 as there would not have been a share holder meeting since the bonus, just wondering if the point was raised before at a meeting or if any concerns before it was approved?

May have mentioned here, but did wonder after the Demebele sale if those extra millions in, bear in mind we effectively bought no players in the window, had any bearing on any amount received in bonus.

Hopefully the rumours of KT and Calmac offers are nothing, but Lenny at the press conference yesterday, there is a point where he is asked about players out, he briefly looks down at the table, little things sometimes give away a persons discomfort.
Concerning if anyone was financially incentivised to have players out when playing wise it makes no sense.

In context - Personally accept, don't like it but accept that Celtic are now a buying and selling club, not because any PLC director tells us, the accounts do!
Reliant on selling players to make profits.
Even though I have a few old ordinary PLC shares, could not care what their value is, bought emotionally it was the bit of paper to say part of. Only shares I own.
So questions are of a Celtic Football Club fan
 
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Jim, I have not the foggiest about the financial world or its inner-dynamics.

I'd suggest that people who operate in that environment only think in terms of currency and not human sentiment and emotion.

It seems that their only real buzz in life comes from "the deal" and how it impacts upon their own top and bottom line.

I would find it highly likely though that folk operating at the high end of that field would have some type of "broker" clause written into their contract. I'd also guess that that clause covers transfers, sponsors, advertisers and even things like dealing with the operators who provide flights, coaches, accommodation and fancy disco lights.

I'm not sure it's even the cash that motivates these people, it's the playing-on-the-edge, brinksmanship and sealing the deal that appears to be their biggest motivating factor.
 
Cluster One 20th June 2019 at 18:55
But later on in the Article the bomb is dropped and in bold too.
…….
THERE WILL COME A POINT WHERE THE CURRENT INVESTORS WON’T PUT MONEY IN ANYMORE, SO IT COULD THEN BE UP TO THE FANS.
…………………………………..
On another point.
According to financial papers supporting the bid, the extra shares Dave King’s group would get from the loan conversion would mean their slice of Rangers International.
Football Club plc would rise from 34.06% to give them a majority 53.93% stake.
Once converted Mr King’s slice through his New Oasis Asset Limited company will grow from 14.57% to 26%, Mr Park’s holding will rise from 6.14% to 13.94%, Mr Letham will have 5.7%, up from 4.05%, while Mr Taylor’s interest will drop from 9.3% to 8.14%.
…………..
“Consequently, RIFC was making significant losses with no immediate possibility of those being stemmed whilst restoring the fortunes of Rangers Football Club. Such losses have now been greatly reduced and the fortunes of both Rangers Football Club and RIFC have been significantly restored.
……………………….
If the bubble bursts down ibrox way, would Mr King’s slice through his New Oasis Asset Limited company be the main creditor
ie. would king have the most to gain if the bubble bursts?
Corrupt official 21st June 2019 at 19:52

Cluster One 21st June 2019 at 18:50
If the bubble bursts down ibrox way, would Mr King’s slice through his New Oasis Asset Limited company be the main creditor ie. would king have the most to gain if the bubble bursts?
———————————————————————————————–
Most will know better than I, but if the loans are converted to shares, they will not be creditors as nothing is owed….(unless some conditions are attached?)
If, and when….Celtic win 9 IAR I imagine the following season when Celtic are attempting 10, that would be the optimum time to put it to the fans to dig deep. ,

would say Celtic are doing alright by their fans if you compare below

RANGERS RETAIL LIMITED
Company number 08142409
Registered office address
Unit A Brook Park East, Shirebrook, NG20 8RY
Company status
Active — Active proposal to strike off
Company type
Private limited Company
Incorporated on
13 July 2012

KING, David Cunningham
Correspondence address
Ibrox Stadium, Edminston Drive, Glasgow, United Kingdom, G51 2XD
Role Active
Director
Date of birth
August 1955
Appointed on
4 June 2015
Nationality
British
Country of residence
South Africa
Occupation
Businessman
 
Sevco are a chancer club led by a chancer, yes the world knows that! Sevco the sole heir of a demised penniless tramp

That some Celtic fans even consider comparing Celtic finances by using Sevco as a example is illogical, that some do possibly suggests they have concerns at the back of their mind we are not doing as well as we could be or as far in front as we could be.

Even if I am raising the anomaly of how comes PL can be paid a EPL type salary but supposedly impossible for our players!
Even though we likely missed out on Millions last window and before, Ntcham and Boyata should have been sold, that they weren't was down to not so great general management, replacements not sourced in good time.. another question another topic.
Not really questioning the overall Celtic PLC finances here, overall a decent enough job it seems,

Here just wondering if anyone knew what part if any! the sale of Dembele, a player that it seems highly likely BR had intended as a partner alongside Eddy. played in PL's bonus.
Wondered if anyone knew if the 20 or so millions pushed the bonus into a higher tier!

Because logically if so then the plan is flawed, as we have people who are financially incentivised to sell players at times when possibly not in the football clubs best interest.
The plan was approved by the board, so nothing illegal, just flawed! if so!
 
On the plus side of tonight's embarrassment, thankfully the balance sheet still looks great for potential hedge fund investors and bonus plans for over rated over paid bloats called directors who clearly think that football is secondary to profits and hope for financial luck more than actively go look for it!.

Reality check for the fan bhoys of PL, & especially those who think we have spent some money this season!
We have not actually spent a risked cent for a couple of seasons now, take into account the recent players and wages offloaded, the reported 9 millions LCFC bonus from BR & team, the likes of Julien & Bolo were covered with millions of change to spare so far unspent, but! it is true it is looking great on the bottom line for vulture funds.

Thankfully PL on behalf of the potential investors had the likely tens of millions of losses from a another early CL exit covered with his encouragement of KT to AFC.

We could take some encouragement where it counts , on the field, if only Lenny has noted that we have a poor quality defensive midfield, as in 1 man band Broony trying to do it all, we have no other quality genuine defensive midfielder and this has been shown any time we have faced any pressing team for more than 2 seasons now.
We have effectively a great attacking line, decent enough defenders, but no midfield, just Broony!
And yet and remarkably!
Lenny was recently quoted as saying how vital Broony was and did not know what we would do without him!
So? Does Lenny need someone to spell out what that wonder equals, or has he been hired just to repeat PL lines.

The League now is all, so in the context of what we saw tonight, should hope we don't try too hard in the Thursday Europa league! because we are just not good enough to risk having a go at that and then try and play the weekend.
The last teams to try that! were the now dead club who won feck all that season and severak seasons before when a MON's much better Celtic side with a genuine midfield reached the same in the final but won SFA that season.

Some one at Celtic had best remind those who think they manage of how history works, it tends to repeat itself.
Or we can hope against logical trend that Lawell approves some serious investment, starting with a midfielder in Broonys mould not another attacking midfielder and a quality goalkeeper.
 
JimMc said:
On the plus side of tonight's embarrassment, thankfully the balance sheet still looks great for potential hedge fund investors and bonus plans for over rated over paid bloats called directors who clearly think that football is secondary to profits and hope for financial luck more than actively go look for it!.

Reality check for the fan bhoys of PL, & especially those who think we have spent some money this season!
We have not actually spent a risked cent for a couple of seasons now, take into account the recent players and wages offloaded, the reported 9 millions LCFC bonus from BR & team, the likes of Julien & Bolo were covered with millions of change to spare so far unspent, but! it is true it is looking great on the bottom line for vulture funds.

Thankfully PL on behalf of the potential investors had the likely tens of millions of losses from a another early CL exit covered with his encouragement of KT to AFC.

We could take some encouragement where it counts , on the field, if only Lenny has noted that we have a poor quality defensive midfield, as in 1 man band Broony trying to do it all, we have no other quality genuine defensive midfielder and this has been shown any time we have faced any pressing team for more than 2 seasons now.
We have effectively a great attacking line, decent enough defenders, but no midfield, just Broony!
And yet and remarkably!
Lenny was recently quoted as saying how vital Broony was and did not know what we would do without him!
So? Does Lenny need someone to spell out what that wonder equals, or has he been hired just to repeat PL lines.

The League now is all, so in the context of what we saw tonight, should hope we don't try too hard in the Thursday Europa league! because we are just not good enough to risk having a go at that and then try and play the weekend.
The last teams to try that! were the now dead club who won feck all that season and severak seasons before when a MON's much better Celtic side with a genuine midfield reached the same in the final but won SFA that season.

Some one at Celtic had best remind those who think they manage of how history works, it tends to repeat itself.
Or we can hope against logical trend that Lawell approves some serious investment, starting with a midfielder in Broonys mould not another attacking midfielder and a quality goalkeeper.
Click to expand...
We had that opportunity last summer when Lawell fucked about over McGinn, broonys natural successor but he fucked about over a few quid. And your right Celtics bank balance continues to grow as we are actually not spending more than we bring in.
 
True enough McGinn was a major mess by PL.
Those who blame BR for all, should at least accept that farce would anger any credible manager.

For those who think that PL is carrying on the role of Fergus
Here is how his salary has risen long since Fergus left, he has awarded himself these massive increases approved by a board that rubber stamp themselves.

View attachment 3249

And it appears at least 5.3 million over these last 3 account years with that bonus, which = approx. £1 million and 7 hundred and 66 thousand pounds per annum plus any additional expenses
or approx. £34,000 per week

And my point(s)!
wage cap? can't compete with the EPL? logical unless! 100% rule unless!

https://www.teamtalk.com/news/spurs-director-levy-highest-paid-premier-league

Example
Liverpool FC top man – £914,000 (inc pension contribution) year ending 30 June 2017.

We know from accounts that PL received earnings more than his Liverpool equivalent and has been picking up more since 2012

The cap must fit, yet he pays himself a EPL type crown, a top six EPL type crown at that by accounts

But again to be fair, Brother Walfrid will be happy enough as PL did eventually approve the living wage for most who work at Celtic, after a public media campaign.
 
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As mentioned previous, I worked in the 'finance industry' for long enough to know that the 'Peter principle' was never more appropriate.
Peter Lawell is as common as muc in the industry, no genius or special skill sets going on, in some areas it is to the contrary.

Unlike a few, I am not taking easy shots now, I stated that here and elsewhere from word go, never bought into the hype and BS of PL, as I've seen it all before.
Cover_of_The_Peter_Principle_by_Pan_Books.jpeg


And seen the human types who whilst not having a clue themselves, applaud along and mock anyone who dares rock the boat.
Some of them must imagine 'our own Peter' has a money tree that he grew and prunes for us.

Go read the accounts! or go learn how to! a short cut clue > add up player sales, then take away from net profits! then try come back and state the supposed financial whizz you assumed still exists.

Worse yet, our Peter is nearer retirement than peak, so not only is it extremely likely his mental ability is not as good as it once was, but he will also likely be less flexible than he once was!

So for anyone assuming or hoping he is going to see the light, those hopes don't likely add up either.
 
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Peter Lawell takes more in salary and benefits from Celtic FC than his Liverpool FC equivalent.


Now is the time, to keep this overpaid man of limited ability and limited vision for Celtic under severe pressure, it is the only hope we have against what clearly is a habit of his of Celtic team being restricted while his own salary is maximised.


As reported by the Guardian 2018
EPL Highest paid Director

Liverpool FC Highest-paid director Unnamed, £914,000
Everton FC Highest-paid director Unnamed: £588,000
Chelsea FC Highest-paid director £229,000 to unnamed director of Chelsea Football Club Ltd.
Leicester City FC Highest-paid director Unnamed, £325,000 (Susan Whelan is the chief executive)
Southampton FC Highest-paid director Unnamed, £606,000 (Ralph Krueger is the chaiman)
West Ham United Highest-paid director Unnamed, £868,000 (Karren Brady is the executive vice-chairman)

untitled.png

So bad news we are being lied to but the great news bhoys is we can compete with the EPL!
Or at least Peter lawell has ensured he personally can! increasing his initial reported salary from 2004 (at the time a relatively competitive salary compared to many in the EPL) several times around 600% not including the extra millions in bonus!
 
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JimMc said:
Peter Lawwell to receive £2.3 million bonus at New Year for his performance over last 2 years .

Anyone read enough of the PLC accounts or in the know enough to know if any Directors bonus is tied to a specific(s) target turnover or profits?
Are there any tiered scales for example - achieve this amount in a period and get this reward - in simple terms!

Or anyone been present at any previous share holders meeting to know if any question were raised re the Executive Long Term Incentive Plan (“ELTIP”) and possible concerns?
Of course nothing will have yet been asked specifically re the £2,296,000 paid to Peter Lawell on 31 Dec 2018 as there would not have been a share holder meeting since the bonus, just wondering if the point was raised before at a meeting or if any concerns before it was approved?

May have mentioned here, but did wonder after the Demebele sale if those extra millions in, bear in mind we effectively bought no players in the window, had any bearing on any amount received in bonus.

Hopefully the rumours of KT and Calmac offers are nothing, but Lenny at the press conference yesterday, there is a point where he is asked about players out, he briefly looks down at the table, little things sometimes give away a persons discomfort.
Concerning if anyone was financially incentivised to have players out when playing wise it makes no sense.

In context - Personally accept, don't like it but accept that Celtic are now a buying and selling club, not because any PLC director tells us, the accounts do!
Reliant on selling players to make profits.
Even though I have a few old ordinary PLC shares, could not care what their value is, bought emotionally it was the bit of paper to say part of. Only shares I own.
So questions are of a Celtic Football Club fan
Click to expand...
probably related to share price like most other companies
 
JimMc said:
True enough McGinn was a major mess by PL.
Those who blame BR for all, should at least accept that farce would anger any credible manager.

For those who think that PL is carrying on the role of Fergus
Here is how his salary has risen long since Fergus left, he has awarded himself these massive increases approved by a board that rubber stamp themselves.

View attachment 3249

And it appears at least 5.3 million over these last 3 account years with that bonus, which = approx. £1 million and 7 hundred and 66 thousand pounds per annum plus any additional expenses
or approx. £34,000 per week

And my point(s)!
wage cap? can't compete with the EPL? logical unless! 100% rule unless!

https://www.teamtalk.com/news/spurs-director-levy-highest-paid-premier-league

Example
Liverpool FC top man – £914,000 (inc pension contribution) year ending 30 June 2017.

We know from accounts that PL received earnings more than his Liverpool equivalent and has been picking up more since 2012

The cap must fit, yet he pays himself a EPL type crown, a top six EPL type crown at that by accounts

But again to be fair, Brother Walfrid will be happy enough as PL did eventually approve the living wage for most who work at Celtic, after a public media campaign.
Click to expand...

To hell with you Jack, I’m alright. Springs to mind.
 
For me PL is beyond any chance, any attempt at qualifying or any naïve attempt for context, he is a grossly overpaid chancer in any context who has promoted his own hype and in doing so has held back Celtic FC in too many areas.

The accounts do not show a great business mind let alone a guru!
He can go now!
Don't believe his departure will make any difference to the team provided he is replaced by a competent accountant, one paid to do just that and nothing else, we have in situ plenty of other hangers on like Bankier who can do the BS promo PR stuff, those many events and attendances mainly designed for non football fans.

Unfortunately the team management situation is a different problem, as we have very likely left it too late to get players in who are going to provide the depth in quality to make a mark in Europa and the league this season. So logically and emotionally the league is now all. Likely too late to get in a decent qualified assistant coach, if PL is even looking for one there?

No matter who comes in will face unreal pressure to just win the league and again it will be too late for them to bring enough players in, so logically the current risk in replacing Lenny is as high as not replacing him.
There is the problem
But some of the points recently being spouted by Lenny since the Cluj embarrassment are close to the farcical and chancer like.
The situation very sad to say is not that dissimilar to the Ronny dilemma, where the fans who loved Celtic knew that a short term loss to sevco would likely mean a quick response. The only reason that PL was over ridden and BR brought in was that semi final cup loss.

A loss to AIK and hearts and sevco and Lenny is out, loss to just two of them and he's going to be under severe pressure to go. Lenny best believe that is no hysterics!

Fans do not deserve or need to accept this second rate management going on right now, events created essentially by PL a supposed CEO and self convinced master of all things football.
 
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The-Peter-Principle.jpg


Only fair to point out that 'on first name terms connection with the 'peter principle' was likely outside of his control, presumably he did not decide his own first name to match a business moral lesson.

However, there is at least a credible wonder if PL was looking for his initials to match another business principle of a select few.
swpkt9_large.jpg
 
Bump to highlight Pistol Pete, the real problem at our club.
Pistol petes penny pinchin & dealz r responsible for allowing a broke zombie club to lead Celtic.

Will not matter who next manger is if pistol is allowed to be puppet master, buying players that BR for certain (Shved) & likely NFL never requested.
 
Blaming NFL for the now, is the low cheap option.

NFL never employed himself or any of the not Celtic first team quality assistants or scouting team, Pistol team & vision provided him.

Celtic are a Giant club & should be a much better team on the field than we have been provided with via Pistols limited Celtic PLC.
This has been coming (needlessly) for a couple of seasons at least, but sadly pistol had enough cheer-leading types purposely placed around him in the boardroom & sadly many more fans claiming happy enough with yesterday & calling out anyone complaining as a hun or just whining.
 
DHoopster said:
Bump to highlight Pistol Pete, the real problem at our club.
Pistol petes penny pinchin & dealz r responsible for allowing a broke zombie club to lead Celtic.

Will not matter who next manger is if pistol is allowed to be puppet master, buying players that BR for certain (Shved) & likely NFL never requested.
Click to expand...
list the penny pinching deals please
 
DHoopster said:
Blaming NFL for the now, is the low cheap option.

NFL never employed himself or any of the not Celtic first team quality assistants or scouting team, Pistol team & vision provided him.

Celtic are a Giant club & should be a much better team on the field than we have been provided with via Pistols limited Celtic PLC.
This has been coming (needlessly) for a couple of seasons at least, but sadly pistol had enough cheer-leading types purposely placed around him in the boardroom & sadly many more fans claiming happy enough with yesterday & calling out anyone complaining as a hun or just whining.
Click to expand...
giant club in what respect

its not a giant in comparison to the tv deal clubs

and its that huge gulf in finance that prevents club from buying the best players to play at our large supported club

fanbase is not enough to pay the big wages alone.

not when your worst epl tea gets 100 million every season from tv compared to our 5

and that 95 million gap doesn't get clawed back even if we reach
cl

so you want epl top half players but who funds the 150 million gap minimum each season that they get from sky that we dont even if we reach cl

liverpool got 250 million from tv alone last season before tiger prizes and sponsors and the rest

how do you compete with that quality without those bungs?
 
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