Gutman in no mans land

Monkee

Monkee

Active member
Seen this on facebook. Wonder what will happen to him now. Maybe get brought back to the club or sent out on loan to someone else.

ANDREW GUTMAN is tonight in football no mans land after his ‘loan club’ Nashville Soccer Club have tonight reported the MLS will not sanction the loan move and he will NOT be joining the US club.

Statement...
This past week, Nashvill Soccer Club had announced its intent to take defender Andrew Gutman on loan from Celtic F. C However, as an expansion member of MLS and in light of the fact that MLS does not support the transaction. Nashvill will not be proceeding with the loan.

We wish Andrew the best this season, and we will have no further comment on the matter.
 
Monkee said:
Seen this on facebook. Wonder what will happen to him now. Maybe get brought back to the club or sent out on loan to someone else.

ANDREW GUTMAN is tonight in football no mans land after his ‘loan club’ Nashville Soccer Club have tonight reported the MLS will not sanction the loan move and he will NOT be joining the US club.

Statement...
This past week, Nashvill Soccer Club had announced its intent to take defender Andrew Gutman on loan from Celtic F. C However, as an expansion member of MLS and in light of the fact that MLS does not support the transaction. Nashvill will not be proceeding with the loan.

We wish Andrew the best this season, and we will have no further comment on the matter.
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Wonder what Brendan will make of that !! He looks decent btw & we need ALL the defensive cover we can get due to the injury situation .... and don’t start me on THAT !! HH
 
Yeah but facebooks fulla shite. What gives it credence to you? Who’s facebook
 
Issue is that another MLS club holds Gutman’s rights - the club that drafted him, Chicago Fire. So if he’s to play in the MLS, he has to go to Chicago.

The other option is to send him to a club in the 2nd tier which is where Manny Perez is now playing. That’s not a great league (it’s basically a semi-pro league), but it’s better than nothing if Chicago won’t take him.
 
BenLynch29 said:
Issue is that another MLS club holds Gutman’s rights - the club that drafted him, Chicago Fire. So if he’s to play in the MLS, he has to go to Chicago.

The other option is to send him to a club in the 2nd tier which is where Manny Perez is now playing. That’s not a great league (it’s basically a semi-pro league), but it’s better than nothing if Chicago won’t take him.
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Seems like a proper fk up. Jeez ?
 
_Neil_ said:
Are they cheap?
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Neither one had ever signed a professional contract. That’s complicating efforts to get them work visas in the UK, but it also means there were no transfer fees and wages are very low by Celtic standards. Depending on development, one or both could be in the picture for a World Cup roster spot with America in 3 years (assuming they qualify). Also, while they’re on loan in the USA, their loan club will be picking up most/all of the wages, so there’s virtually no downside to these signings.
 
The guy is 22 so he is edging out of the prospect category. He was being sent back to get game time which I was fine with. As things stand we have 2 fit full backs that are going to get game time. Discounting gamboa and dependant on lustigs knock. If we have him in mind to be ready in 6months then he can be brought in to the squad now. We are a few bumps away from Hayes and gamboa starting. He can play on both flanks apparently.
BR wants players bedded in so get it done
 
Big Bobo's bunnet said:
The guy is 22 so he is edging out of the prospect category. He was being sent back to get game time which I was fine with. As things stand we have 2 fit full backs that are going to get game time. Discounting gamboa and dependant on lustigs knock. If we have him in mind to be ready in 6months then he can be brought in to the squad now. We are a few bumps away from Hayes and gamboa starting. He can play on both flanks apparently.
BR wants players bedded in so get it done
Click to expand...

Gutman is still a prospect, even at the age of 22, in the sense that he’s never played a game of professional football in his life. He’s only ever played against amateurs (and amateurs that have no future in the professional game even in the MLS). At this point in time, Gamboa and Hayes are far superior options on both flanks. We’ve got kids in our academy that are better options right now than Gutman if it comes to that. And nevermind the fact that Gutman doesn’t have, and can’t get, a work permit for the UK right now.

The rationale for his signing, I think, is to develop him into a player who will contend for a USA national team spot for the 2022 World Cup and then sell him on.
 
I was thinking about Gutman being in no-man’s land last night.

What makes this even more unusual is that Nashville - the club he was to be loaned to - isn’t playing in the MLS this season. They’re playing in a totally different league that isn’t affiliated with MLS, yet MLS and one of MLS’ member clubs are the ones blocking this move. Now, Nashville has been awarded entry into MLS in 2020, so they’re playing along with whatever MLS wants here, but from Celtic’s point of view I do believe there are sufficient grounds to pursue legal remedies. This is interference at its most basic level, and it’s depriving Gutman from playing for a non-MLS club.

If I were in any position at Celtic Park, I would be pushing to have this case go to FIFA and/or CAS. It’s unlikely to be resolved in time for Gutman to play for Nashville this season, but the precedent is important and there may be the possibility of monetary damages as well.

Lastly, James wrote an article a while back speculating that Celtic would be setting up a club in America, likely to be the 2nd or 3rd tier, where we could build brand recognition as well as have a place to develop American players like Gutman. My feelings are that it’s going to be a commercial failure, but I do think there is merit from a development standpoint. Also, it gives some players a legitimate option if they don’t want to sign for an MLS club but still want to play at a reasonably high level (assuming Celtic have control of development and coaching).
 
BenLynch29 said:
Gutman is still a prospect, even at the age of 22, in the sense that he’s never played a game of professional football in his life. He’s only ever played against amateurs (and amateurs that have no future in the professional game even in the MLS). At this point in time, Gamboa and Hayes are far superior options on both flanks. We’ve got kids in our academy that are better options right now than Gutman if it comes to that. And nevermind the fact that Gutman doesn’t have, and can’t get, a work permit for the UK right now.

The rationale for his signing, I think, is to develop him into a player who will contend for a USA national team spot for the 2022 World Cup and then sell him on.
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Thanks for the extra info. I wasn't aware that he hadn't made the jump to pro, wrongly assumed due to his age he would of been. After a bit of looking it seems like a severe case of sour grapes on Fires part after he snubbed them :/. Can't help but feel the situation could of been handled better if this was a potential outcome. Saying that there's no way of knowing that they would of thrown the toys out if the pram the way they have done. Keep us posted mate
 
Big Bobo's bunnet said:
The guy is 22 so he is edging out of the prospect category. He was being sent back to get game time which I was fine with. As things stand we have 2 fit full backs that are going to get game time. Discounting gamboa and dependant on lustigs knock. If we have him in mind to be ready in 6months then he can be brought in to the squad now. We are a few bumps away from Hayes and gamboa starting. He can play on both flanks apparently.
BR wants players bedded in so get it done
Click to expand...
At the rate things are going, those few bumps will not take long but I hope I am wrong.
 
BenLynch29 said:
I was thinking about Gutman being in no-man’s land last night.

What makes this even more unusual is that Nashville - the club he was to be loaned to - isn’t playing in the MLS this season. They’re playing in a totally different league that isn’t affiliated with MLS, yet MLS and one of MLS’ member clubs are the ones blocking this move. Now, Nashville has been awarded entry into MLS in 2020, so they’re playing along with whatever MLS wants here, but from Celtic’s point of view I do believe there are sufficient grounds to pursue legal remedies. This is interference at its most basic level, and it’s depriving Gutman from playing for a non-MLS club.

If I were in any position at Celtic Park, I would be pushing to have this case go to FIFA and/or CAS. It’s unlikely to be resolved in time for Gutman to play for Nashville this season, but the precedent is important and there may be the possibility of monetary damages as well.

Lastly, James wrote an article a while back speculating that Celtic would be setting up a club in America, likely to be the 2nd or 3rd tier, where we could build brand recognition as well as have a place to develop American players like Gutman. My feelings are that it’s going to be a commercial failure, but I do think there is merit from a development standpoint. Also, it gives some players a legitimate option if they don’t want to sign for an MLS club but still want to play at a reasonably high level (assuming Celtic have control of development and coaching).
Click to expand...
It appears that people in any position at Celtic don't do pushing... though I concede that is just my perception and they may indeed be like a swan in appearing to do nothing on the surface and paddling like the hammers of hell under the surface.
 
We haven’t spent any real money on these lads. If we had I would be worried it’s more resources going down the drain. I am hoping they get a chance to show what they can or can’t do before losing faith in them. I realise they haven’t played at a high level, but that doesn’t mean they can’t.

Nobody starts out at a high level. That’s the nature of the game. I was particularly impressed with Perez and hope he can step up, as well as Gutman. Time will tell.
 
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