Josh Adam latest Celtic starlet to exit? Price of successful Celtic?

[Winter]

Reading the latest on Celtic's young starlets leaving the club , this time its the turn of young Josh Adam(16) , player of the tournament at the Marc Overmars youth tourney, young josh is the 3rd youngster we look like losing in quick succession. Rumour has it that we had knocked back a six figure sum from man city for young Josh but now that hes turned 16 City are able to acquire his services for a small cross border development fee. We have seen the same thing with Liam Morrison to Bayern and it's looking likely that young Barry Hepburn could follow Liam to Munich. Is there really anything that the club can do about this? Losing our up and coming stars is far from ideal, yes, we have benefitted from this cross border development fee ourselves most notably with Moussa Dembele. It speaks highly of the club that our players are being head - hunted at such a young age. Is this the reality of having such a strong 1st team squad? The club have brought forward youngsters of late , young karamoko dembele being one of many. There are only so many positions available though, is there anything more the club can do too keep our young talent? Or is this the price of being so successful?

 

[Winter]

I've changed that title, was a little on the negative side. When really it's a nod to the success of both the 1st team squad and the youth team. ☘

 

[Bridie Bhoy]

Reading the latest on Celtic's young starlets leaving the club , this time its the turn of young Josh Adam(16) , player of the tournament at the Marc Overmars youth tourney, young josh is the 3rd youngster we look like losing in quick succession. Rumour has it that we had knocked back a six figure sum from man city for young Josh but now that hes turned 16 City are able to acquire his services for a small cross border development fee. We have seen the same thing with Liam Morrison to Bayern and it's looking likely that young Barry Hepburn could follow Liam to Munich. Is there really anything that the club can do about this? Losing our up and coming stars is far from ideal, yes, we have benefitted from this cross border development fee ourselves most notably with Moussa Dembele. It speaks highly of the club that our players are being head - hunted at such a young age. Is this the reality of having such a strong 1st team squad? The club have brought forward youngsters of late , young karamoko dembele being one of many. There are only so many positions available though, is there anything more the club can do too keep our young talent?

I'm afraid it is the rules. Children are protected until 16 when they are free to sign deals with senior clubs. This will continue while the authorities allow clubs to poach and stockpile dozens and dozens of youngsters in the hope that a few will make it big. That will not change as it suits the very richest clubs so there is no drive for UEFA to put a stop to this and it would be fought tooth and nail by the "big" teams anyway.

There should be follow-up clauses inserted to reward the finders after certain milestones are met by the youngster rather than just small % of future sales.

As you rightly say, we have benefited too so all we can do is try to take advantage of the rules and try to minimise player losses, but this is hard when trying to break into first team squads.

Also, I suspect once teams are used to using 5 subs in a match that this temporary ruling won't be rescinded by FIFA (remember when the 3rd sub for goalies only was introduced then very quickly abused and so relaxed) and we will get more opportunities to give our young talent game time.

 

[Winter]

I'm afraid it is the rules. Children are protected until 16 when they are free to sign deals with senior clubs. This will continue while the authorities allow clubs to poach and stockpile dozens and dozens of youngsters in the hope that a few will make it big. That will not change as it suits the very richest clubs so there is no drive for UEFA to put a stop to this and it would be fought tooth and nail by the "big" teams anyway.

There should be follow-up clauses inserted to reward the finders after certain milestones are met by the youngster rather than just small % of future sales.

As you rightly say, we have benefited too so all we can do is try to take advantage of the rules and try to minimise player losses, but this is hard when trying to break into first team squads.

Also, I suspect once teams are used to using 5 subs in a match that this temporary ruling won't be rescinded by FIFA (remember when the 3rd sub for goalies only was introduced then very quickly abused and so relaxed) and we will get more opportunities to give our young talent game time.

Very true BB the number of youngsters on the books at City and Chelsea is gross. They are buying up the best youngsters in bulk knowing that only a small number of them will ever play for the club. When you see , every Europa league that chelsea have anything up to 30 players out on loan to clubs participating in the EL Or the CL that's just not right and even monopolistic. These players (mostly) are nothing more than business investments, bought for selling on at profit. It speaks volumes to the work our u-16 coaches Robertson, McNab and one George McCluskey have been doing. Also the U-15 coaches McLaughlin and Mark McNally. All of the youth team deserve massive credit. If it's true that we kbd a six figure sum for young Josh then it makes you wonder why didnt we sign him up professionally if he is worth that much at 15. For all we/I know the club might well have offered a contract. No one can really blame these youngsters for having their head turned. If Josh does go to Citys academy then it shows the level of confidence that he has as not many make it through that academy Patrick Roberts a good example. Success for our club will always result in clubs chasing our players whether established or youth. Swings and roundabouts? Still, something doesnt sit right that a cash rich club like city and Bayern are using the cross border development fee to attract players , I hope like all that weve put a decent sell on clause or something to that effect. I personally dont think that the club can do much about this, I agree also with you that UEFA need to have a look at this but dont hold much faith in it. Still , heres hoping HH

 

[Bridie Bhoy]

Very true BB the number of youngsters on the books at City and Chelsea is gross. They are buying up the best youngsters in bulk knowing that only a small number of them will ever play for the club. When you see , every Europa league that chelsea have anything up to 30 players out on loan to clubs participating in the EL Or the CL that's just not right and even monopolistic. These players (mostly) are nothing more than business investments, bought for selling on at profit. It speaks volumes to the work our u-16 coaches Robertson, McNab and one George McCluskey have been doing. Also the U-15 coaches McLaughlin and Mark McNally. All of the youth team deserve massive credit. If it's true that we kbd a six figure sum for young Josh then it makes you wonder why didnt we sign him up professionally if he is worth that much at 15. For all we/I know the club might well have offered a contract. No one can really blame these youngsters for having their head turned. If Josh does go to Citys academy then it shows the level of confidence that he has as not many make it through that academy Patrick Roberts a good example. Success for our club will always result in clubs chasing our players whether established or youth. Swings and roundabouts? Still, something doesnt sit right that a cash rich club like city and Bayern are using the cross border development fee to attract players , I hope like all that weve put a decent sell on clause or something to that effect. I personally dont think that the club can do much about this, I agree also with you that UEFA need to have a look at this but dont hold much faith in it. Still , heres hoping HH

I totally agree Winter. But we won't be able to insert sell on clauses as they are free agents - there is a fixed formula for development of players (I seem to remember a youth team in the Netherlands received €13K when Virgil signed for Liverpool as he'd briefly played for them as a youngster for 2 weeks). UEFA will do nothing about it.

 

[kelly]

Well done to the lads that are moving on and well done to the club for bringing them through , you can't keep everyone if there's no clear route for them to develop further

it's a hard one to call as we don't have the set up to keep them signed and for that matter interested

You look at the youth/development set up in England and Germany they have leagues/euro tournaments and the structure and finance to fund it ,unfortunatley we don't and dismantling the reserve league has it's faults

Sevco put there youths into the euro league as a chance to cash in on their youngsters , most top clubs do they're talent spotting at the various tournies around europe

they can afford to

 

[Winter]

Well done to the lads that are moving on and well done to the club for bringing them through , you can't keep everyone if there's no clear route for them to develop further

it's a hard one to call as we don't have the set up to keep them signed and for that matter interested

You look at the youth/development set up in England and Germany they have leagues/euro tournaments and the structure and finance to fund it ,unfortunatley we don't and dismantling the reserve league has it's faults

Sevco put there youths into the euro league as a chance to cash in on their youngsters , most top clubs do they're talent spotting at the various tournies around europe

they can afford to

Yes K wish them the best and hope they go far. I dont know why sevco are bothering lol no seriously they did lose Billy Gilmour to Chelsea and he looks the real deal but sevco didnt benefit from it instead they lost a quality player.

 

[Niall J]

I've actually written on this subject today. Although Hepburn and Adam haven't gone yet it looks like they will follow young Liam Morrison out the door. Morrison's feedback at the time was that Bayern showed him a four year plan for his development based around six month intervals where they would sit down and re-evaluate. apparently Celtic don't do that. It's not a money issue as Celtic can compete at the youth end of the market. Apparently scouts, agents and parents have said Celtic are a little complacent and that digital scouting means clubs can access video scouting of youth players far easier than they could in the past, hence we perhaps have just become a little complacent in this regard. Hopefully that's something we can remedy by chatting to players we have lost or are losing and see where we went wrong and address the issues. Before it becomes a bigger problem than it is. Offer players a roadplan to first team through age groups and loan deals. I think we just need to do a bit of tweaking. I'm fairly sure we can learn some quick lessons. We've just been caught a bit short.

 

[kelly]

Yes K wish them the best and hope they go far. I dont know why sevco are bothering lol no seriously they did lose Billy Gilmour to Chelsea and he looks the real deal but sevco didnt benefit from it instead they lost a quality player.

quick cash
That's all it was and it was stupid thing to do as he could have made them more by making him pro and signing him up
Can understand where our club is coming from and where the young guys are ,for every year Celtic release players who then go on to give up the game or play on for a few years before chuckin it

The one's who do go on to the big supermarket clubs stand little chance of a breakthrough although they are all given the chance to do it ,gilmour being the case

But for every Gilmour there's a feruz

 

[Winter]

I've actually written on this subject today. Although Hepburn and Adam haven't gone yet it looks like they will follow young Liam Morrison out the door. Morrison's feedback at the time was that Bayern showed him a four year plan for his development based around six month intervals where they would sit down and re-evaluate. apparently Celtic don't do that. It's not a money issue as Celtic can compete at the youth end of the market. Apparently scouts, agents and parents have said Celtic are a little complacent and that digital scouting means clubs can access video scouting of youth players far easier than they could in the past, hence we perhaps have just become a little complacent in this regard. Hopefully that's something we can remedy by chatting to players we have lost or are losing and see where we went wrong and address the issues. Before it becomes a bigger problem than it is. Offer players a roadplan to first team through age groups and loan deals. I think we just need to do a bit of tweaking. I'm fairly sure we can learn some quick lessons. We've just been caught a bit short.

Sorry Nial I didnt mean to steal your thunder but I agree with you that we can remedy this by speaking with the kids on what they perceive as the clubs shortcomings on this and learn from it. Its obvious our youth team has been coached superbly well when these clubs want our kids. This as you say is perhaps one thing the club can do about this ☘

 

[Winter]

quick cash
That's all it was and it was stupid thing to do as he could have made them more by making him pro and signing him up
Can understand where our club is coming from and where the young guys are ,for every year Celtic release players who then go on to give up the game or play on for a few years before chuckin it

The one's who do go on to the big supermarket clubs stand little chance of a breakthrough although they are all given the chance to do it ,gilmour being the case

But for every Gilmour there's a feruz

Feruz for me got what he deserved , football like any occupation takes commitment something Feruz was sadly lacking. Good luck Islam selling you're bunnets.

 

[Niall J]

Sorry Nial I didnt mean to steal your thunder but I agree with you that we can remedy this by speaking with the kids on what they perceive as the clubs shortcomings on this and learn from it. Its obvious our youth team has been coached superbly well when these clubs want our kids. This as you say is perhaps one thing the club can do about this ☘

Not in the slightest Winter, maybe I stole yours. Im glad it's a subject being debated as it might waken the club up a wee bit. We've done a lot of good work in a short space of time behind the scenes fixing the shambles Congerton left behind, think we've maybe taken the eye off the ball at home. Should be easily remedied with a little communication. Might be worth asking Tierney and Johnston what their thoughts have been, was it left to their talent and luck or did they feel as supported as they could have been.

 

[Winter]

Not in the slightest Winter, maybe I stole yours. Im glad it's a subject being debated as it might waken the club up a wee bit. We've done a lot of good work in a short space of time behind the scenes fixing the shambles Congerton left behind, think we've maybe taken the eye off the ball at home. Should be easily remedied with a little communication. Might be worth asking Tierney and Johnston what their thoughts have been, was it left to their talent and luck or did they feel as supported as they could have been.

I somehow doubt that you stole mine but you're correct that the fact that we are debating this shows the level of interest we all show when it comes to all things Celtic. I like the idea of asking former prodigies come good their own take on this situation. ✌☘

 

[The Shamrock]

I'm afraid it is the rules. Children are protected until 16 when they are free to sign deals with senior clubs. This will continue while the authorities allow clubs to poach and stockpile dozens and dozens of youngsters in the hope that a few will make it big. That will not change as it suits the very richest clubs so there is no drive for UEFA to put a stop to this and it would be fought tooth and nail by the "big" teams anyway.

There should be follow-up clauses inserted to reward the finders after certain milestones are met by the youngster rather than just small % of future sales.

As you rightly say, we have benefited too so all we can do is try to take advantage of the rules and try to minimise player losses, but this is hard when trying to break into first team squads.

Also, I suspect once teams are used to using 5 subs in a match that this temporary ruling won't be rescinded by FIFA (remember when the 3rd sub for goalies only was introduced then very quickly abused and so relaxed) and we will get more opportunities to give our young talent game time.

A very sensible approach BB.

 

[26+6=1]

Our vile enemies make despicable comments in regard to Celtic and youth football.
Apart from their irrational hatred these comments are fueled by their jealousy of Celtic's youth setup.
Kenny Dalglish and Kieran Tierney are but two examples.
The world knows about youth football at Celtic and the reason they do is because of the historical quality of production.