European football

Winter said:
I was agreeing with your post this time until you got to "Sevco are a better counter attacking side than Celtic " , I don't agree with that.
I watched the sevco v Motherwell game highlights and they were ripped apart by Well umpteen times on the counterattack.
Had Well still got a Van Veen type striker on their books I'm certain they'd have scored a few goals from the chances they'd made, that's why despite winning the game they were booed off the park at ft.
I also watched Aberdeen against Ross County and their counterattacking play was beautiful to watch , buoyed by their performance in Frankfurt.

We are too quick to talk our game down in Scotland, when our games not that bad at all it's the investment in it and its mismanagement of it.
Celtic have never payed wages on a par with the bigger countries , there was a time we paid decent money but only rangers oldco have ever competed in that way but they were cheating HMRC and the club died. Sevcos " better results in Europe " have come at a lower level , one we rarely play at the Europa league, the competition is nothing like that which we face in the champions league, something they brutally found out last season.
When we do play at that level , last 3 times anyway we showed reasonably well 3rd , to leverkusen and betis, season b4 was the terrible season we were awful and before that we topped our group of lazio , cluj and rennes for the first time, so I don't accept that rangers are better in Europe because they don't play at our level, they play against clubs that finish 7th and 5th in their seasons table.

I'm not sure why you're saying all these clubs are masonic either TET then zionist ?
If anything that kind of thinking plays more of a role in our own game I'd think with the sectarianism in our game.
This is all besides the point anyway , which is, lubos point that it's bs that we cannot attract quality players to the club because of wages and that is as he said bs.
If that were true there would've been no Jota, no CCV, Starfelt, Maeda but we keep on selling and not reinvesting buying replacements that are of the same standard.

We had the chance to do that last window but saw Podence head on loan to Greece, Livakovic go to Turkey for around £5 million, and we certainly could have matched his wages and offered more than the Turks but didn't because the board have no ambition beyond Scotland and that lack of ambition will cost our club anyone who thinks differently is mistaken imho.

We've had this debate before you and I buddy and I understand you're points , you're satisfied with being Scotland's best ( or you said that one time, perhaps youre not )I won't hold one post as your viewpoint but it's not enough for the rest of us.
Net value negative, net value positive, I know absolutely net zero supporters coming back from any Celtic match I've ever attended over the years, or sat in the pub with who are talking or thinking that way or could give a damn about it unless it's reflected on the park.
Of course no-one wants us bankrupt but we expect at least the board to make an effort, a concerted effort not a one off season.
Celtics poor signings have been the result of gambling on project players , Celtics good signings have cost us that little bit extra but made us that much more when we sell.
Not every signing, project or experienced will work out, this is football after all and not an exact science nor business either when it comes to players transfers.
The fact that we the fans are seeing record turnover year after year and the highest paid CEO in lawell in British football was Celtics should give a hint to where the moneys going.
This is just my viewpoint on the debate TET and not a slant nor dig at your goodself mate HH
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Is he the highest paid CEO?
The massive lump in bank is more down to the lawells NPV negotiating rather than the players we brought in. Players his team managed to convince to come here under terms that benefits club sustainability.
Its the wages that matter for sustainability.
These superior signings that he made were agreed by the player for whatever reason.
The board are there to invest in Net present value opportunities and invest in assets that add value to club. Scouting team are there to identify players who are good enough to play on field.


You identify the first team player you want upgraded and why. How much do you think we can get for that player? Pick any signing made for the clubs in Portugal Holland Belgium or Scandanavia this season who you think make us better team for CL in the position you want upgraded.

If record turnovers are good isnt lawell doing what he paid to do? Are the trophies won contributing factor to the income? If so, does his crappy not good enough signings win trophies? And if they win trophies isnt he doing what he paid to do by maximising income?
Profit rather than turnover indicates club health more than record turnovers in a hyper inflated market for assets. And wages overall dictate profit.

And im not sure any club in europe make better NPV signings than Celtic.

Wee fergus Mccann was much more stingy on wages than Lawell team. But Fergus is remembered fondly because he was NOT silent.

So sack lawell for not doing that part of his job well.

The players are the ones who dont want the luxury deals that Lawell offers them. simply because they can get better terms at clubs elsewhere. Ajax paid a fortune for a left back in recent memory and he wasnt worth it imo. it was a very risky purchase. Would you have bought that player for Celtic on terms Ajax offered him? Would he have come here even if we matched it or bettered it? Why did he go to Ajax rather than someone else? Was it because they offered him the biggest wage?





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I'm no going to pretend that I've read some of the shite on this thread (you've made some excellent points BTW Winter)

The fact is, our board are happy to hoover up fans money from season ticket sales and merchandise sales. They are happy to brag about their sponsorship deals and massive profits. They were happy to watch the media drop name after big name, over the tranfer window...thus given Celtic fans hope of something special coming down the line, in turn making them part with more of their hard earned cash, all to end up going into the Champions League weaker than last season.

At any point they could have come out and said "actually, we have to stay in margins and follow our model business plan so it will be more project signings and tankins in Europe"..Maybe they should have got you to do the announcements TET, seeing as you're the expert....but they didn't. They wanted us to believe the media hype.
 
Lubos left peg said:
I'm no going to pretend that I've read some of the shite on this thread (you've made some excellent points BTW Winter)

The fact is, our board are happy to hoover up fans money from season ticket sales and merchandise sales. They are happy to brag about their sponsorship deals and massive profits. They were happy to watch the media drop name after big name, over the tranfer window...thus given Celtic fans hope of something special coming down the line, in turn making them part with more of their hard earned cash, all to end up going into the Champions League weaker than last season.

At any point they could have come out and said "actually, we have to stay in margins and follow our model business plan so it will be more project signings and tankins in Europe"..Maybe they should have got you to do the announcements TET, seeing as you're the expert....but they didn't. They wanted us to believe the media hype.
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Not only were they happy to let the media namedrop the more expensive players, but they were the ones tipping their media friends off (yes, there are some) in the first place. These were often started by journalists with "close contacts" within the upper echelons of Celtic's management team.

This included several getting told that we'd be breaking our transfer fee record this last summer. It was a lot of old jakey tramp shite! The board abused the trust of these guys by deliberately misleading them with nonsensical leaks, to try to head off the genuine anger felt by so many Celtic fans & tractor drivers at the return of Rodgers to Parkheid.

I would imagine that a fair few reporters were pissed off at their contacts for being made to look foolish with these ridiculous predictions. And so many fans feel disappointed and misled because the financial report proves that we could have afforded to invest in a couple of more expensive players as we did before for Jota & CCV.
 
Bridie Bhoy said:
Not only were they happy to let the media namedrop the more expensive players, but they were the ones tipping their media friends off (yes, there are some) in the first place. These were often started by journalists with "close contacts" within the upper echelons of Celtic's management team.

This included several getting told that we'd be breaking our transfer fee record this last summer. It was a lot of old jakey tramp shite! The board abused the trust of these guys by deliberately misleading them with nonsensical leaks, to try to head off the genuine anger felt by so many Celtic fans & tractor drivers at the return of Rodgers to Parkheid.

I would imagine that a fair few reporters were pissed off at their contacts for being made to look foolish with these ridiculous predictions. And so many fans feel disappointed and misled because the financial report proves that we could have afforded to invest in a couple of more expensive players as we did before for Jota & CCV.
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I think were getting a wee bit carried away with board members planting stories. It's the media's job to sell papers, so they print shite day after day to achieve that objective. People would rather buy into delusions, you ain't going to sell much by telling the truth.. The Huns are case in point
'breaking transfer fees/big C L push', that was made up by papers. You heard Rogers, it wasn't even a conversation they had.
the board don't need to sell season books, they sell themselves every year and will continue to do so while there's the waiting list

Oh and PL is Chairman, Nicholson is CEO.
 
Lubos left peg said:
I'm no going to pretend that I've read some of the shite on this thread (you've made some excellent points BTW Winter)

The fact is, our board are happy to hoover up fans money from season ticket sales and merchandise sales. They are happy to brag about their sponsorship deals and massive profits. They were happy to watch the media drop name after big name, over the tranfer window...thus given Celtic fans hope of something special coming down the line, in turn making them part with more of their hard earned cash, all to end up going into the Champions League weaker than last season.

At any point they could have come out and said "actually, we have to stay in margins and follow our model business plan so it will be more project signings and tankins in Europe"..Maybe they should have got you to do the announcements TET, seeing as you're the expert....but they didn't. They wanted us to be
Click to expand...

There's a distinct split between what our supporters see as the key objectives for our club and what they do. The difference is frightening.
The day wee Fergus saved the club, he also monetized it. And as we're seeing now, once you monetise a football club, a wee part of its soul is lost.
We look like a football club and are supported like a football club, but the guys that run it see it as a business and we are all as Kelly says customers.
For us it's product on the park for them it's money in the bank and that's just the truth of ut
 
Smelltheg-love said:
I think were getting a wee bit carried away with board members planting stories. It's the media's job to sell papers, so they print shite day after day to achieve that objective. People would rather buy into delusions, you ain't going to sell much by telling the truth.. The Huns are case in point
'breaking transfer fees/big C L push', that was made up by papers. You heard Rogers, it wasn't even a conversation they had.
the board don't need to sell season books, they sell themselves every year and will continue to do so while there's the waiting list

Oh and PL is Chairman, Nicholson is CEO.
Click to expand...
I understand that the majority of journalists make up any old shite to sell tomorrow's fish wrappers or get clicks. But it was the particular ones who were writing these stories that Celtic were going to go bigger that implied that this was genuine as they are known to have close contacts high up in the Celtic organisation. So no, I don't believe that I was getting carried away suggesting that the club was planting stories in the media, as they have been doing this for decades (read Archie MacPherson's book on Jock Stein for a perfect example of this at work).

I know that PL is the Chairman and Nicholson is CEO - not sure why that remark was directed at me, STG.
 
Bridie Bhoy said:
I understand that the majority of journalists make up any old shite to sell tomorrow's fish wrappers or get clicks. But it was the particular ones who were writing these stories that Celtic were going to go bigger that implied that this was genuine as they are known to have close contacts high up in the Celtic organisation. So no, I don't believe that I was getting carried away suggesting that the club was planting stories in the media, as they have been doing this for decades (read Archie MacPherson's book on Jock Stein for a perfect example of this at work).

I know that PL is the Chairman and Nicholson is CEO - not sure why that remark was directed at me, STG.
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I don’t doubt it went on for years m8, but I’m doubtful it goes on these days. Between the talks with rogers in Marbella and the appointment there was a couple of weeks. They made it out that he was demanding XYZ. If you listen to him since it’s all shite. Typical media, Rogers was promised XYZ and he’s unhappy etc.

Oh aye the CEO remark I read and just added on to post. The sort of shit you do when hungover tae feck. It’s not directed at you it was just lazy
 
Lubos left peg said:
I'm no going to pretend that I've read some of the shite on this thread (you've made some excellent points BTW Winter)

The fact is, our board are happy to hoover up fans money from season ticket sales and merchandise sales. They are happy to brag about their sponsorship deals and massive profits. They were happy to watch the media drop name after big name, over the tranfer window...thus given Celtic fans hope of something special coming down the line, in turn making them part with more of their hard earned cash, all to end up going into the Champions League weaker than last season.

At any point they could have come out and said "actually, we have to stay in margins and follow our model business plan so it will be more project signings and tankins in Europe"..Maybe they should have got you to do the announcements TET, seeing as you're the expert....but they didn't. They wanted us to believe the media hype.
Click to expand...

Folk are forgetting we have to continue to keep providing annual preferential share dividends to DD, Hedge Fund Shareholders and the like…
 
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