Scottish Independence

Benignus said:
You wouldn't believe the amount of people during the scottish referendum who I was asking why they were voting to stay in the UK, thought that a vote for independence meant a life of Nationalism, I was gobsmacked, even when I explained that if the country voted yes a general election would be first thing on the agenda after we all sobered up, they couldn't see it, they thought everybody voting yes was a nationalist and the SNP would reign over Scotland.
We bottled it as a nation, and I'm sorry, but I now want chaos through a hard brexit like this country has never seen in modern history, England will become intolerant after brexit, the sooner we leave her to her own devices the better mate.
After living through years of tory rule 1979 to the present day (New Labour to me were as right wing as they come) I feel we can take the shrapnel wounds you mentioned, middle age folks like ourselves SP, may not reap the full benefits of an independent Scotland and I don't expect to, but I might relax a bit more if when I see the youngsters in this country have a better chance than we did mate.
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Agree B,I am 73 this year,if independence comes I may not get full benefit from it,but would have the satisfaction of knowing I voted for it to happen,have been snp for years,before the rise of the snp,always voted labour, family were miners ,steelworkers etc,so that was the party , then they were honest hard working, our local doc was the mp for us,how days have changed now !they are now committed to the union with the rest,think the only way is snp,sure if independence did happen ,and later there was elections, labour voted in would need to do the will of the people,can’t see that ,!!!!!!
 
Ray said:
Agree B,I am 73 this year,if independence comes I may not get full benefit from it,but would have the satisfaction of knowing I voted for it to happen,have been snp for years,before the rise of the snp,always voted labour, family were miners ,steelworkers etc,so that was the party , then they were honest hard working, our local doc was the mp for us,how days have changed now !they are now committed to the union with the rest,think the only way is snp,sure if independence did happen ,and later there was elections, labour voted in would need to do the will of the people,can’t see that ,!!!!!!
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I'm going to come in from a different angle. At the time I was dragged of a coals. I studied a bit never qualified never done fuck all if I'm honest. Kept up to date and blanked out the mad propaganda.
I nearly got punched or close to it several times around the ref vote.
The one argument I made was that 9 out if 10 of the propositions made were exactly akin to what I'm seeing now in brexit.
Take a deep breath and have a think.
Economics
My points at the time oil wise
Everone was singing and dancing
I pointed out that when the middle east settles the barrel will plummet and we will be priced out. And collapse
I was nearly punched by my brother several times.
I'm not going to go into what he called me

I brought up the road tax argument. What's that you ask? My point was under our current population we couldn't afford to maintain our roads past the point of an Albanian track per mile per head per coin .

Exports. Apart from employment we don't own alot. Golf and whiskey
 
Not ours.
It's embarrassing that we are slagging brexit. We tried it fucked it. And didn't have a plan
It's the same thing
Take a honest detached look. Deals with the Eu.
Possible trade agreements.
Pride aside, William Wallace on a quad bike with an uzi.
It's happening again
I'm not wanting to argue really or be attacked. It's the points in my post that stray from the norm I want to ask about.
End to the tyranic leaders eu/Westminster ?
Take all our money, westmonsrer?( We will agree to say in the eu) no belive that the entrepreneurs could build our economy.
We were sold that. All words no support networkneas provided. All words by politicians.
We stick on more per heed than they do?
That's is with England/eu billions
That's more than the UK does with the EU
They didn't give us the backup. We asked and we didn't get it.
I work with and have worked with more nationalities than most.
Scots are viewed well bit we still have a complex. A dominating one .
I have a long list of why every nation through thier peculiarities are dicks. We list in it
 
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Big Bobo's bunnet said:
Not ours.
It's embarrassing that we are slagging brexit. We tried it fucked it. And didn't have a plan
It's the same thing
Take a honest detached look. Deals with the Eu.
Possible trade agreements.
Pride aside, William Wallace on a quad bike with an uzi.
It's happening again
I'm not wanting to argue really or be attacked. It's the points in my post that stray from the norm I want to ask about.
End to the tyranic leaders?
Take all our money?
We stick on more per heed than they do?
That's is with England.
That's more than the UK does with the EU
They didn't give us the backup. We asked and we didn't get it.
I work with and have worked with more nationalities than most.
Scots are viewed well bit we still have a complex. A dominating one .
I have a long list of why every nation through thier peculiarities are dicks. We list in it
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Nailed it ??
 
Side note...why aren't we mates with America now. Donny isn't a mug (mmmm) there is no reason why he should have to share oil profits with us. We share a golf course. He has British engineers ...The best . And American mulla and privy on war head tip supplies. Tech and game. The old agreement is dead tranny may knows it. The US is pissing themselves at it.
Am I the only one seeing it?
 
Big Bobo's bunnet said:
Side note...why aren't we mates with America now. Donny isn't a mug (mmmm) there is no reason why he should have to share oil profits with us. We share a golf course. He has British engineers ...The best . And American mulla and privy on war head tip supplies. Tech and game. The old agreement is dead tranny may knows it. The US is pissing themselves at it.
Am I the only one seeing it?
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naw bobo we're aw fucked,so let the good times roll!!!!
 
Big Bobo's bunnet said:
Side note...why aren't we mates with America now. Donny isn't a mug (mmmm) there is no reason why he should have to share oil profits with us. We share a golf course. He has British engineers ...The best . And American mulla and privy on war head tip supplies. Tech and game. The old agreement is dead tranny may knows it. The US is pissing themselves at it.
Am I the only one seeing it?
Click to expand...
Naw, but that is exactly why brexit is such a cluster fuck, BBB?

I'm pretty sure that the heavy industries that the commonwealth turned a buck on are all but gone. The giant supermarkets have pretty much complete ownership of arable land. The dependence on fossil fuel has seen the Americans drain our oil reserves (if they were actually ours in the first instance) and along with it, any notion that britain has any influence to exert.

The only relevance of an isolated Britain, is that it gives Russia, or perhaps China, an entry point into western Europe with either gas or steel bribes.

Britain has as much clout as their token monarch and it is dependent on their relationship with mainland Europe for any remaining car industry of note, or profitable mass production industries. Without these fluid trading links, the tariffs imposed on Britain will cripple its economy and these foreign investors will happily fuck off to central and Eastern Europe to open their production points.

Britain sealed its own fate when it tarted itself out to America Post WWII. That is the most principled reason why Scotland needs independence, to forge its own path with our European neighbours and disengage itself from the tumour that's weighing us down and eating us from the inside out.

Forget oil, that was never on the agenda as a feasible long-term revenue stream, but there are more important geographical features and resources that make our corner of the island an attractive proposition to mainland Europe. During the entente cordial, France weren't interested in us due to our military might. They were interested in our location and nuisance value.

In the aftermath of any brexit agreement, Nethanhayu, MBS, Putin and China will be making eyes at britain with nothing but their own interests at heart. Britain will become the world's biggest laundry for dirty money, dirty fuel, dirty nuclear plants and dirty blood diamonds.

Then again, according to bozo boris, nasty nigel and little tommy tit robinson, we'll have a thriving health service (ha fuckin ha), less immigration and sterling world trading partners that will generate trillions in trade (ha fuckin haha).

Regardless of anyone's political perspective, brexit doesn't play out well for Scotland, it doesn't play out well for Ulster - and Wales will effectively have english county-status.

An independent Scottish Republic doesn't immediately turn into industrial utopia. It will struggle for generations to come until it carves its own wee niche through a willing to adapt and finding alternative solutions ; however - it would be OUR struggle alone, not one enforced by westminster dimwits who have all the vision of stevie wonder in a pea-souper.

It's NOT a nationalist question. It does not automatically assume that the SNP are the most influential political presence. It is a means to an end which will represent a new beginning.

If we fuck up, then it will be our fuck up. We can even take ownership of it and be proud of it, but surely it's better than being buckled up the chutney by Westminster on a fairly regularly occurring basis?

It's all hypotheticals in the meantime, you're right to assert that the world is pissing itself laughing, BBB. That same world is also pissing itself laughing at the mentally challenged fool operating in Washington and if you need further evidence of the future of britain after being subjugated by Russia, then look no further than Washington and the shutdowns, trade defecits and having it's arse felt by the great bear.

MD referred to a potential civil war in the aftermath of any independence strategoy. I happen to think he has a point. The thing is that that may not be as bloody and protracted as other civil conflicts, in so much that the voices of dissent are the hard-line orange bastards whose relevance is being diluted year-by-year. Up north - the decent protestant population want no part of that jambo-ree. That's also being evidenced in Ulster while they procrastinate over their own commitment to their future. It's a negative prognosis, but not any more negative than families being unable to feed themselves and a second Highland clearance as a result of a hard brexit and no hope of soft trade deals with Europe. In that scenario, there is no fucking way the English will allow us to feed ourselves. Our resources will be topping up the swamp down south.

I'm not an authority on the subject and I'm certainly not an expert, but I do believe that we have a once in a lifetime opportunity to make our presence felt and start a long, painful - but ultimately promising chapter in our country's long history.
 
Spherical Planet said:
Naw, but that is exactly why brexit is such a cluster fuck, BBB?

I'm pretty sure that the heavy industries that the commonwealth turned a buck on are all but gone. The giant supermarkets have pretty much complete ownership of arable land. The dependence on fossil fuel has seen the Americans drain our oil reserves (if they were actually ours in the first instance) and along with it, any notion that britain has any influence to exert.

The only relevance of an isolated Britain, is that it gives Russia, or perhaps China, an entry point into western Europe with either gas or steel bribes.

Britain has as much clout as their token monarch and it is dependent on their relationship with mainland Europe for any remaining car industry of note, or profitable mass production industries. Without these fluid trading links, the tariffs imposed on Britain will cripple its economy and these foreign investors will happily fuck off to central and Eastern Europe to open their production points.

Britain sealed its own fate when it tarted itself out to America Post WWII. That is the most principled reason why Scotland needs independence, to forge its own path with our European neighbours and disengage itself from the tumour that's weighing us down and eating us from the inside out.

Forget oil, that was never on the agenda as a feasible long-term revenue stream, but there are more important geographical features and resources that make our corner of the island an attractive proposition to mainland Europe. During the entente cordial, France weren't interested in us due to our military might. They were interested in our location and nuisance value.

In the aftermath of any brexit agreement, Nethanhayu, MBS, Putin and China will be making eyes at britain with nothing but their own interests at heart. Britain will become the world's biggest laundry for dirty money, dirty fuel, dirty nuclear plants and dirty blood diamonds.

Then again, according to bozo boris, nasty nigel and little tommy tit robinson, we'll have a thriving health service (ha fuckin ha), less immigration and sterling world trading partners that will generate trillions in trade (ha fuckin haha).

Regardless of anyone's political perspective, brexit doesn't play out well for Scotland, it doesn't play out well for Ulster - and Wales will effectively have english county-status.

An independent Scottish Republic doesn't immediately turn into industrial utopia. It will struggle for generations to come until it carves its own wee niche through a willing to adapt and finding alternative solutions ; however - it would be OUR struggle alone, not one enforced by westminster dimwits who have all the vision of stevie wonder in a pea-souper.

It's NOT a nationalist question. It does not automatically assume that the SNP are the most influential political presence. It is a means to an end which will represent a new beginning.

If we fuck up, then it will be our fuck up. We can even take ownership of it and be proud of it, but surely it's better than being buckled up the chutney by Westminster on a fairly regularly occurring basis?

It's all hypotheticals in the meantime, you're right to assert that the world is pissing itself laughing, BBB. That same world is also pissing itself laughing at the mentally challenged fool operating in Washington and if you need further evidence of the future of britain after being subjugated by Russia, then look no further than Washington and the shutdowns, trade defecits and having it's arse felt by the great bear.

MD referred to a potential civil war in the aftermath of any independence strategoy. I happen to think he has a point. The thing is that that may not be as bloody and protracted as other civil conflicts, in so much that the voices of dissent are the hard-line orange bastards whose relevance is being diluted year-by-year. Up north - the decent protestant population want no part of that jambo-ree. That's also being evidenced in Ulster while they procrastinate over their own commitment to their future. It's a negative prognosis, but not any more negative than families being unable to feed themselves and a second Highland clearance as a result of a hard brexit and no hope of soft trade deals with Europe. In that scenario, there is no fucking way the English will allow us to feed ourselves. Our resources will be topping up the swamp down south.

I'm not an authority on the subject and I'm certainly not an expert, but I do believe that we have a once in a lifetime opportunity to make our presence felt and start a long, painful - but ultimately promising chapter in our country's long history.
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great post SP!
brexit, one winner-russia!
uk -phuqed, banana republic,the finance sector already phuqin off from the city of london
all the little engerlunders who still think "britain" are phuqed, when there's no foreign labour to harvest fruit and veg,man the health service,the hospitality industry and so on,try selling scottish independence in larkhall and kilwinning!!! let the good times roll!!!
 
we'll get a great deal from europe,aye phuqin right boris! 27 countries say otherwise! and if we did get a "great deal" how many of those 27 would be queuing to leave to get a "great deal" aye exactly! britains gettin hee phuqin haw fae europe,so tae aw the brexiteers,diz the phrase "turkeys votin fur xmas spring tae mind!!!!"
the eu's no perfect,but the main thing it's done apart from phuqin prosperity, is phuqin peace in europe!!!! putin is pishin himself laughin!!! let the good times roll, SP summed brexit up perfectly-CLUSTERFUCK!!!
 
Scotland is endowed with wind. wave and hydro power. Oil aplenty, but we dont want to burn oil now. it is still a good resource. Food and drink industry is top class. universities well regarded world wide. Our problem is England cant afford us to separate, despite their bluster that they subsidise us. The Yanks too will fight tooth and nail to stop their nukes being moved. So indy wont be easy, but it will be well worthwhile. Dont let the bigots dictate our destiny.
 
Gherybhoy57 said:
Scotland is endowed with wind. wave and hydro power. Oil aplenty, but we dont want to burn oil now. it is still a good resource. Food and drink industry is top class. universities well regarded world wide. Our problem is England cant afford us to separate, despite their bluster that they subsidise us. The Yanks too will fight tooth and nail to stop their nukes being moved. So indy wont be easy, but it will be well worthwhile. Dont let the bigots dictate our destiny.
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love the sentiment ghery, but the yanks have called time on europe,wee scotland included! "america first"!!!
 
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